Windows 8: The Thread

[TANWare]

The problem with this is not for the occasional casual user but power users and more importantly productivity users. If all you need is the interface provided to you by your phone then why not just use your phone only?

While the phone may mimic some of the usability of a PC it does not cover the gamut of uses a PC has over a phone or similar device. I have an Android phone but would not give up my PC functionality for it. Same thing follows suit to use my PC as my mobile comunication device..............

[Rodster]

Who is Microsoft forcing? If you don't like Windows 8 you can always stick with Windows 7.

Good point !

I think W8 will look and work best on Tablets or AIO PC's with a touchscreen.

[Pirx]

Windows 8 will usher in whole new breeds of laptops that have touch screens or enhanced trackpads to better navigate its start screen. There will be tablet-laptop hybrids & convertibles.

All of that hardware has been available for years. You know, these kinds fo user interfaces are quite well understood by now. In brief, it turns out that nobody wants a touch-centric interface on either a desktop or laptop. The only situation where touch interfaces can make sense is for handheld devices, i.e. phones and tablets. There is one minor exception for certain terminal-like applications, and potentially that kitchen PC, but even for those, if you want to do anything resembling serious productivity work, what you want is a mouse and keyboard.

Touch screen desktops (all-in-ones) will become more meaningful too. The Windows 8 user experience on new hardware will be far superior than on existing hardware.

One would hope so, but the point is that for the minority of people who actually do work on their computers, productivity on Win8 will be impaired.

Who is Microsoft forcing? If you don't like Windows 8 you can always stick with Windows 7.

That is correct, and that is what a large number of people will do.

The problem with this is not for the occasional casual user but power users and more importantly productivity users. If all you need is the interface provided to you by your phone then why not just use your phone only?

Exactly, or use a tablet if that's all you need. I might add in parentheses that even on these devices, I have serious reservations regarding Microsoft's Metro interface. As a consequence, while I am thinking about getting a Samsung Series 7 slate later this year, I will almost certainly not run Win8 on it.

[Sagar Jacky]

All of that hardware has been available for years. You know, these kinds fo user interfaces are quite well understood by now. In brief, it turns out that nobody wants a touch-centric interface on either a desktop or laptop. The only situation where touch interfaces can make sense is for handheld devices, i.e. phones and tablets. There is one minor exception for certain terminal-like applications, and potentially that kitchen PC, but even for those, if you want to do anything resembling serious productivity work, what you want is a mouse and keyboard.

Windows 8 does work with a mouse & keyboard! Now they're also adding touch to the mix in order to broaden the scope & use of the PC. The hybrid form factors that existed so far were not running OSes designed or optimized for touch. With Win 8 that will change. A capable software can spawn the creation of new & improved hardware.

One would hope so, but the point is that for the minority of people who actually do work on their computers, productivity on Win8 will be impaired.

The problem is, keeping PCs the same is leading to a gradual but certain decline. And no industry can survive in a declining state for long. Windows 7 is a great OS, but it cannot stop the erosion. There has to be change, there has to be innovation. Win 8 is trying to think along new lines while letting you do all that you could do with Windows 7.

That is correct, and that is what a large number of people will do.

I disagree. Old habits will die hard and people may be reluctant in the beginning. But I think they will eventually embrace Windows 8 after realizing its potential and broad-spectrum use.

The problem with this is not for the occasional casual user but power users and more importantly productivity users. If all you need is the interface provided to you by your phone then why not just use your phone only?
While the phone may mimic some of the usability of a PC it does not cover the gamut of uses a PC has over a phone or similar device. I have an Android phone but would not give up my PC functionality for it. Same thing follows suit to use my PC as my mobile comunication device..............

You can perform all power-user tasks on Win 8! They're not taking anything away from it or reducing its capabilities! They're just adding another dimension to Windows.

[Pirx]

Windows 8 does work with a mouse & keyboard!

Sure, but it positively sucks at doing so, and is maddeningly cumbersome to use this way.

The problem is, keeping PCs the same is leading to a gradual but certain decline.

A much bigger and more immediate problem is that ignoring the preferences of 99% of your user base in a quest of chasing that elusive 1% will lead to swift disaster.

There has to be change, there has to be innovation. Win 8 is trying to think along new lines while letting you do all that you could do with Windows 7.

No doubt there has to be innovation (properly understood, of course), but unfortunately Win8 does emphatically not let me do all I could do with Win7, and much of the change, for desktop and laptop use, is change for change's sake, not innovation. The most problematic issue here is that there is no reason at all to not give people the option to use the much better performing UI in Win7 for their work.

I disagree. Old habits will die hard and people may be reluctant in the beginning. But I think they will eventually embrace Windows 8 after realizing its potential and broad-spectrum use.

Please spare me that irrelevant red herring of "habits". My assessment (and the one of the vast majority of professionals using Windows computers, I might add) has nothing to do with habit. There are serious, objective, deficiencies of the Win8 UI for production work that are imposed on us, once again, with no rational justification.

You can perform all power-user tasks on Win 8! They're not taking anything away from it or reducing its capabilities!

Yes, they are, as has been discussed at length here and elsewhere. You might want to make yourself knowledgeable first before embarking on a topic you clearly do not understand.

[funky monk]

I find it amusing how everyone is talking about the need for change. Trying to change something simply because you can is ridiculous.

So far, M+KB seems like the best option for a PC. Sure, you can have a touch screen, but they're a pain if you try to use them for an extended period. I'd liken it to trying to make square wheels becaause "circles are old tech". There's a saying, "if it aint broke, don't fix it". I think that applies here.

[Pirx]

I find it amusing how everyone is talking about the need for change. Simply trying to change something simply because you can is ridiculous.

There's a lot of truth in what you are saying here. Yes, there is a need for Windows to branch out to work well on tablets, but, no, there is no reason for any significant change, let alone the kind of ill-considered radical change that Win8 forces on us, for desktops/laptops.

[Baserk]

^+1
Metro might actually do very well for leisure oriented tablets/phones, it's just monomane having it forced on all PC and/or non-leisure users.
With a 'Metro /off' setting, Windows 8 might have been a well perceived OS.

[Pirx]

^+1
Metro might actually do very well for leisure oriented tablets/phones, it's just monomane having it forced on all PC and/or non-leisure users.
With a 'Metro /off' setting, Windows 8 might have been a well perceived OS.

Exactly. I wouldn't care if they had that Metro stuff optional, because then I could just ignore it, and be perfectly happy with some of the improvements that Windows 8 carries under its hood. My opinion of Windows 8, indeed, would be radically different from what it is now. All that would be required is to make Metro optional, which means, of course, including a fully functional Start Menu on the desktop, and a complete and fully functional Control Panel. It would have cost Microsoft nothing to include this, but they chose otherwise, once again, for no good reason.

[funky monk]

I would even go so far as to say that I can see times when I might want to use metro on a PC. For example if I'm just looking at media and stuff then it might be a more visually pleasing way of doing it, while still being simple enough for metro to work well. However, I really feel it should be the opposite of how it is now, with metro being secondary to the desktop, in that way it would be kinda like media centre.

Granted, their logic makes sense for tablets, but for their main demographic (the PC market) it just seems counter intuitive.