The ThrottleStop Guide

Discussion in 'Hardware Components and Aftermarket Upgrades' started by unclewebb, Nov 7, 2010.

  1. 3g6

    3g6 Notebook Enthusiast

    Reputations:
    0
    Messages:
    45
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    16
    What is this?

    [​IMG][​IMG]
     
  2. unclewebb

    unclewebb ThrottleStop Author

    Reputations:
    6,549
    Messages:
    5,496
    Likes Received:
    4,085
    Trophy Points:
    431
    @3g6 - Many operating systems include this file but some releases of Windows 10 do not.

    If you get the mfc120u.dll is missing message, head to Microsoft and download and install both the x86 and x64 Visual C++ 2013 Redistributable packages from here.

    https://support.microsoft.com/en-ca...l-c-2013-and-visual-c-redistributable-package

    ThrottleStop is a 32 bit program and I assume you are running it on a 64 bit operating system. That is why you need both downloads.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2019
    3g6 likes this.
  3. unclewebb

    unclewebb ThrottleStop Author

    Reputations:
    6,549
    Messages:
    5,496
    Likes Received:
    4,085
    Trophy Points:
    431
    I had my hands on a Lenovo Yoga C930 convertible laptop so I decided to give it a thorough test. When I told my daughter that I was doing some benchmarking with it sitting in the freezer, she thought that maybe I was being a little too thorough with my testing. :D

    Not a lot of bloatware from Lenovo so I was able to get the idle C0% down to 0.2.
    https://i.imgur.com/vJELCMp.png

    Individual cores averaging 99% in C7 and the CPU package spending over 85% in Package C8 is another good sign of a laptop free from useless crud.
    https://i.imgur.com/tazlvt9.png

    Lenovo gets a gold star for leaving the power limits unlocked so ThrottleStop can perform some magic. At default settings, I initially saw a variety of throttling issues but they were easy to overcome. I set the long and short power limits to 45W, clicked on the Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits feature, increased the PP0 Current Limit and the IccMax current limits to 80 to get rid of the EDP throttling and I did some undervolting. It locked up at -120 mV but it seemed stable at -110 mV. I went for a conservative -100 mV across the board for the CPU Core, Cache, iGPU and iGPU Unslice. Basic undervolting 101.

    How does it perform? Pretty good for a thin laptop that only weighs 3.0 lbs. The fan speed and air flow is non-existent so when pressed hard, it will thermal throttle. A cooling system that is designed for a CPU with a 15 Watt TDP becomes inadequate when running it at or beyond 30 Watts. Should I complain? I don't think so. If a person needs a laptop with a 45 Watt TDP rating, they should not be looking at thin and light or a U series CPU. This laptop is a good compromise.

    755 points in Cinebench is more than respectable for an 8550U. Tossing it in the freezer only got me an extra 5 points. There is just no significant fan speed to keep it cool so it thermal throttles half way through Cinebench testing.

    https://i.imgur.com/DhI7ErY.png

    In the CPU-Z bench, it is performing on par with a 4790K.
    https://i.imgur.com/gybEEUk.png

    Here is a custom Lenovo logo for ThrottleStop.
    https://i.imgur.com/6SRGMOu.png

    Just rename it to logo.png, add it to your ThrottleStop folder, restart ThrottleStop and you too can have a customized version of ThrottleStop. I am surprised that more users have not used this trick to create their own ThrottleStop versions.

    Edit - The included Samsung PM981 is first class for sequential read speed. It is only a 256GB drive so many of the other scores are on the low side compared to the 512GB or 1TB NVMe drives in this series.

    https://i.imgur.com/olThGbA.png
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2019
  4. Emil8x

    Emil8x Notebook Enthusiast

    Reputations:
    0
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Hi unclewebb, thanks for great insights.

    Still not able to get around 3.3 GHz when under load even with overclocking on... I attached a screenshot the TS Bench test with the settings and results in it. The utilization flashes red-yellow when the test ends if that helps. Annotation 2019-03-26 165619.jpg

    For the control of my fan noise, I created a second profile in TS without Turbo like you said. The issue now is that the CPU always stays at the max base clock of 2.4 GHz, even at idle. That is if my Windows balanced profile is set to Best Performance as you stated I should do. I feel this is a waste of resources. I prefer it goes back to like 800 MHz when not under load. If I want to achieve this, I would have to set my Windows profile to balanced (in the middle). It makes a little bit of too much steps in my opinion. Without the TS profile, I just have to switch between Balanced and Best performance in Windows to toggle Turbo Boost. If there's an easier way of controlling Turbo or reducing fan noise with TS, let me know!

    I don't remember if my CPU was under load for the C-state window screenshot. I attached new ones while it's at idle, plus what's going on in Task manager (Memory and CPU). Memory.png CPU.png

    Looking at the background tasks, I don't see anything using a lot of CPU or ram to my limited knowledge, other than my Adobe CC subscription software, which I need. Hopefully the Task Manager screenshots can give you a better idea of what's going on.

    For the time resolutions, it returns to 15.624 after closing chrome. Also, what does the Non Turbo Ratio mean/do?

    Emil
     
  5. Jdpurvis

    Jdpurvis Notebook Evangelist

    Reputations:
    71
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    83
    Trophy Points:
    41
    Note that, when TS is showing FID in ~24 range, but CO is low (only a few percent), then processor is mostly idle - it is running at 24 when it is running. For example, when my 6700HQ is idling, (Speedshift=0), FID is in 32-33 range, but CO% is only a few percent. Fans are silent, because processor is mostly idling. When I run a benchmark, like TSBench, FID drops to 31 (max for all cores active for my processor), and CO% is at 100%. Temperature begins to rise, and, if it continues, fans speed up.
    I hope this helps.
    Best,

    Joe
     
    Emil8x and unclewebb like this.
  6. unclewebb

    unclewebb ThrottleStop Author

    Reputations:
    6,549
    Messages:
    5,496
    Likes Received:
    4,085
    Trophy Points:
    431
    Have a look at the first screenshot you posted above. In Limit Reasons, THERMAL is glowing in red. ThrottleStop is reporting 97°C and PROCHOT (aka. processor hot) has a check mark beside it. All of these are telling you that your CPU is too hot. It is thermal throttling and slowing down to protect itself from damage. ThrottleStop does not include any features to go beyond this limitation. That is a good thing.

    The core on one side of your CPU is reporting 97°C and the core on the opposite side is reporting 85°C. That is usually a sign that the heatsink is not square to the CPU or the thermal paste or thermal pad need to be replaced. ThrottleStop is reporting 43.6 Watts and your CPU is overheating. For a CPU with a 47 Watt TDP rating, the cooling system in its present state is not adequate.

    Your C States look a lot better. I guess your laptop was not idle when you took the previous screenshot.

    People see a fast CPU and they automatically think that this is a bad thing but is it? When a CPU core goes into the low power C7 state, it is stopped so it is running at 0 MHz and it is disconnected from the voltage rail so it is at 0 volts. Your CPU cores are spending 97% of their idle time in C7 at 0 MHz. Do you think the CPU cores spending the other 3% of their idle time at 800 MHz, 2400 MHz or 3400 MHz is going to make any significant difference to overall power consumption or heat? I found that the idle CPU speed makes virtually no difference. Watching C state activity when idle is far more important than CPU speed.

    If you want to do some testing, you can use ThrottleStop to slow your CPU down to a crawl. Let your computer sit idle and watch the CPU core temperature. Increase the CPU speed and watch the CPU temperature again. When the C States are working correctly, the difference in temperature might be difficult to measure. The advantage of a fast CPU is that it can get tasks done quickly so the CPU cores can spend a bigger percentage of time in C7 where power consumption and heat are minimized.

    The Non Turbo Ratio lets the CPU decide whether it should use the lower multipliers. The default setting for this is 0. Setting this to 1 is a trick so the CPU does not slow down when idle. You were originally concerned that your CPU was not getting up to full speed so I thought this would be a good place to start testing. I always leave this setting on my 4700MQ set to 1 and run the CPU at full speed. My laptop fans are virtually silent when idle and my laptop does not turn into an oven and burn through my lap.

    If the Non Turbo Ratio is set to 0, you should be able to click on the Set Multiplier function and change the CPU speed from fast to slow. When finished testing, try leaving this at 0, clear the Set Multiplier box and try letting Windows manage the CPU speed. This might give you the lower MHz when idle that you are looking for. A slow CPU is not for me but maybe for your situation, it might be appropriate.

    My daughter just installed the Adobe Creative Suite on my desktop computer. I was so impressed that I got her a new laptop. I know people need this stuff for work but wow, it sucks up way too many system resources when it is not even running. The whole whack of Adobe tasks constantly running in the background is ridiculous. I cannot wait for her to install this on her new laptop so I can remove it from my desktop. C state residency time in C8 is going to drop like a rock after this is installed which is not good for battery run time.
     
  7. Emil8x

    Emil8x Notebook Enthusiast

    Reputations:
    0
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Thanks for the recommendations. I will try to your suggestions and see how things go. You're really lucky to be able to run a 4700 MQ with minimal fan noise! My W540 sounds like a rocket launching as soon as I do something! What is your laptop?

    Thanks for confirming that Abobe CC was the culprit. It's really unacceptable what Adobe is doing. That app is useless most of the time. I only use it when I get some new updates. They should really do something about it.

    Best, Emil
     
  8. unclewebb

    unclewebb ThrottleStop Author

    Reputations:
    6,549
    Messages:
    5,496
    Likes Received:
    4,085
    Trophy Points:
    431
    It is a Lenovo Y510P. Same company as your W540 so I would have thought that noise levels would be similar. I am a light duty computer user so most of the time, I can barely hear it running. If you have not cleaned your laptop out for a long time or ever, I highly recommend it. If the heatsink is full of dust, the fan will have to work harder to try and keep it cool.

    I will post a pic of C state activity on my daughter's laptop after she gets the Adobe CC installed. Too many programmers do not pay attention to how their programs work on a laptop. There should be zero CPU load from any program that is not being used. Adobe programmers do not understand this concept.
     
  9. Vojislav Vlasic

    Vojislav Vlasic Newbie

    Reputations:
    0
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    6
    @unclewebb and the rest of the guys, I'm one of those people that usually just reads though forums, but I've made an account to show my appreciation and to share some info that I have.
    Btw I used ThrottleStop years ago with my sager NP5797, it had T9900 inside - it was fun playing with undervolting back then...

    I've tried HP SPectre X350 15" version with i7-8750H and 1050Ti MaxQ.

    The undervolting was pretty smooth and straightforward.
    I first started at 100mv for both CPU Core and Cache and got to 160 when it froze, went back to 140 and that gave me an error while running TS Bench, so I settled at 130.
    Tested it out with various stress software and left it at idle as well and we're all good, so that's sorted out.
    Being a noob at undervolting the iGpu I started at 40mv...
    The trick with this laptop is that it's not enough to undervolt Intel IGPU and System Agent, you have to undervolt the IGPU Unslice as well.
    I kept pushing it and at some point I tried 130mb (like the Core and Cache) just for fun and that froze the laptop.
    After I restarted I set 100mv and tested it out, all sorts of scenarios and it's stable.

    Running the i7-8750H with the 1050Ti MaxQ at the same time you can bet your processor is going to throttle rather quickly (unless you disable BD Prochot). but then you'll get the GPU to throttle quicker.
    This laptop has nice cooling but it can't really handle these components, at full power they are more then it can chew.

    I've noticed that Windows 10 is dictating SpeedShift EPP value, even if you set some number in TS, Windows overrides it and it sets another number which can be seen in FIVR screen.
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2019
    pressing likes this.
  10. Avé César

    Avé César Notebook Geek

    Reputations:
    13
    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    26
    Check the Chapter 4 here : ( Chapter 4: Make the way the Speed Shift to work as it should be )
    http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...trol-of-the-i7-8750h-advanced-version.823065/
    Have a nice day.

    Again, I thank you so much @unclewebb for your hard work, and throttlestop. You still help people, answering them, following this forum, i can't believe there's still some nice guy in this world helping, and sharing these days... (Sending you loves from France)

    o_O Why customers can't buy a notebook, plug and play, without having some thermal issue or throttling...
     
Loading...

Share This Page