Ryzen vs i7 (Mainstream); Threadripper vs i9 (HEDT); X299 vs X399/TRX40; Xeon vs Epyc

Discussion in 'Hardware Components and Aftermarket Upgrades' started by ajc9988, Jun 7, 2017.

  1. rlk

    rlk Notebook Evangelist

    Reputations:
    132
    Messages:
    565
    Likes Received:
    296
    Trophy Points:
    76
    More likely it simply means nobody has bothered much with running this benchmark, since there are plenty of processors that would beat that (assuming it's heavily MT).

    "What they consider state-of-the-art at roughly the same time point" is, has always been, and will always be a moving target.
     
    tilleroftheearth likes this.
  2. ajc9988

    ajc9988 Death by a thousand paper cuts

    Reputations:
    1,609
    Messages:
    5,852
    Likes Received:
    8,259
    Trophy Points:
    681
    I agree with this sentiment. But, it should be noted Intel is rumored to have gutted a couple features from Willow cover for the back port. Those will not essentially necessarily change the IPC increase overall, though (but it may, as some may effect the floating point scores or cache system, but that is all rumor right now).

    If we assume IPC doesn't change and that the changes for backporting are trivial, then that is 18% for sunny cove and an additional 5-10% for Willow cove (we'll use 7% for industry average, since the rumors come to about that). That is a 25% IPC increase over skylake parts on 14nm, while possibly retaining the 5GHz speed. That is a good chip.

    AMD currently has an approximate IPC over skylake of 11% (some have 15%, some 17% over Zen+, which was around 4% IPC below Skylake, but with a massive frequency deficit) with Zen 2, but still a large frequency deficit. Zen 3 is rumored for 10-12% integer and 17% average IPC.

    So if Rocket was going up against Zen 3 with an approximate 28% IPC increase, rocket would win on frequency, even if we give AMD the benefit of the doubt on 100MHz more all core boost.

    But the rumor is Rocket is a 2021 CPU. So, even though it might start out competing against Zen 3, by the end of the year, it is going against a 5nm Zen 4 with another IPC increase. Assuming similar mid-4GHz frequency to Zen 3, give or take a couple hundred MHz, they would need to keep with the over 12% IPC increase to stay on top with an outright win. Considering their recent track record, it is possible. But this fight will be a close one.

    I don't care if you prefer Intel or AMD, that is a fight worth watching because it will be so close. If AMD gets closer to 17% IPC, Intel has an issue (still close, but they will have an "L" on their hands).
     
    hmscott likes this.
  3. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Super Moderator

    Reputations:
    2,537
    Messages:
    9,567
    Likes Received:
    4,977
    Trophy Points:
    431
    LoL;
     
    hmscott likes this.
  4. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

    Reputations:
    7,079
    Messages:
    20,412
    Likes Received:
    25,193
    Trophy Points:
    931
    Here's an early view of the Intel 10900x:

    Dead On Arrival: Intel i9-10900X CPU Review & Benchmarks vs. 3900X, 3950X, 9900K
    Dec 15, 2019
    Gamers Nexus
    Intel's Core i9-10900X 10-core CPU lands on the HEDT X299 platform and competes in price with the R9 3900X, R9 3950X, and Intel i9-9900K CPUs. The Intel Core i9-10900X is Intel's 10-core, 20-thread CPU that was supposed to be a big step-up from the Intel i9-9900K. It's close in frequency -- sort of -- and higher in core count, but it's also entering a field heavily dominated by the AMD R9 3900X and R9 3950X CPUs. All three of these, of course, have been largely paper launches, but both AMD and Intel are working toward getting shelves more consistently stocked. In the meantime, the 10900X's launch is nothing short of a bloodbath, and it's not in favor of the new Intel 10-core CPU. PCI-e lane count is perhaps the only defensible position, but even that is challenged by other chips on the market.


    A couple of Intel / AMD Fanboy's discuss the state of Intel / AMD, and the Hardware Unboxed World. ;)

    Hardware Unboxed | RX 5500XT, Zen 3, Ray Tracing | Broken Silicon 26
    Dec 13, 2019
    Moore's Law Is Dead
    Steve Walton joins Tom for a long form discussion regarding 2019’s hardware releases, upcoming products, & HWUB’s origins. [Steve’s audio capture crashed. Nothing lost, but audio changes at ~48 min mark]
    1) 0:49 Steve Hides his RTX Money
    2) 4:50 Can Intel even be recommended anymore?
    3) 6:20 Threadripper and Zen 3
    4) 15:15 Hardware Unboxed’s Origins
    5) 27:00 How much work it actually takes to make good content…
    6) 34:00 Why is Tim the Monitor guy?
    7) 37:10 What were your expectations of Zen in 2016?
    8) 45:00 Are PC prices “back to normal”?
    9) 52:30 Comparing this era to the “28nm Era.”
    10) 57:55 Turing, and the value of Ray Tracing.
    11) 1:08:55 RX 5500XT & RX 5600XT
    12) 1:17:20 FCLK Overclocking Capabilities, IPC Comparisons
    13) 1:23:35 Should gamers turn off SMT on Ryzen 3000?
    14) 1:29:35 What is Steve thankful for from 2019?
    15) 1:43:00 What is a big performance increase?


    Ditching Intel for Ryzen, Storage Server Upgrade With Huge Performance Gains
    Dec 16, 2019
    Hardware Unboxed


    So much *cool* new stuff to cover... ;)

    Water Cooling is DEAD. Meet the THERMOSIPHON!
    Dec 15, 2019
    Linus Tech Tips
    9.75M subscribers
    The startup IceGiant is trying to change the computer cooling landscape – and according to our testing they’re off to a good start.
    Pre-Order the ProSiphon Elite: https://www.icegiantcooling.com/
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2019
    jclausius likes this.
  5. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

    Reputations:
    7,079
    Messages:
    20,412
    Likes Received:
    25,193
    Trophy Points:
    931
    Will disparate Intel Pie in the Sky concepts allow their currently inferior architecture CPU's get the jump on AMD / ARM innovations?

    Doubtful, but Coreteks delivers an interesting video that brings some range to the connectivity and communications standards that we use and how they can be re-oriented and re-conceived to deliver useful combinations.

    Are we moving to MODULAR PCs?
    Dec 20, 2019
    Coreteks
     
    Papusan likes this.
  6. Papusan

    Papusan JOKEBOOKs Sucks! Dont waste your $$$ on FILTHY

    Reputations:
    28,282
    Messages:
    25,438
    Likes Received:
    45,643
    Trophy Points:
    931
    Intel Tiger Lake-U Leak Reveals 15W/28W CPU With Up To 4.3GHz Boost Clock hothardware.com | Dec 23, 2019
    Intel released two families of 10th generation mobile processors over the summer: Comet Lake and Ice Lake. Of the two, Ice Lake garnered the most attention as these processors are based on Intel's long-delayed 10nm+ process tech and feature an all-new graphics core. The chip giant is on track to release another round of 10nm mobile processors in 2020 under the codename Tiger Lake...

    For comparison, the fastest Ice Lake SKU, the Intel Core i7-1065G7 has a single core turbo of 3.9 GHz and an all-core boost of 3.5 GHz, so Tiger Lake hitting 4.0 GHz or more would be sizable increase. Since it concerns an engineering example, final clock speeds could be even higher.

    [​IMG]
     
    tilleroftheearth and ajc9988 like this.
  7. ajc9988

    ajc9988 Death by a thousand paper cuts

    Reputations:
    1,609
    Messages:
    5,852
    Likes Received:
    8,259
    Trophy Points:
    681
    From the earlier rumor of 3.6 and 3.8, I've seen that this 4.0 all core boost/4.3 single core boost is allegedly an ES2 sample. It seems they did get something figured out. That is a 10%+ boost in frequency, which is awesome and will require me to reevaluate my last estimate (although tiger lake is currently only planned for mobile while rocket lake with the same core design is planned for desktop). My only question is if they can go further with frequency for 10nm++.

    TSMC barely figured out last minute how to get the frequency to low to mid 4GHz.

    I wonder if they are still using cobalt or not, as the cobalt being brittle and breaking was part of the issue. If they are and they solved that problem, they will be the first fab to have solved it. Using cobalt or similar to deal with electron migration is something all theoretically have to figure out at Intel 5nm/TSMC 3nm. That would put them years ahead on that front, as others focused on EUV (Intel set that to the side waiting for partner's tech to mature).
     
    hmscott likes this.
  8. rlk

    rlk Notebook Evangelist

    Reputations:
    132
    Messages:
    565
    Likes Received:
    296
    Trophy Points:
    76
    Well, Micro Center in Cambridge suddenly had a stock of 3900X's today when I went there, and I bought one (have been thinking about it). Early tests, which don't appear to be exercising the full power of the chip, suggest about 50% faster than the 2700X it's replacing. But those are some single shot ffmpeg runs that don't appear to be able to take advantage of the whole chip. I also spotted that the BIOS reset the memory speed to the default 2133; setting it back to 3000 netted about 7% improvement.

    It will be interesting to see what my big overnight batch jobs do. I'm particularly interested in seeing how the Gutenprint test run does (most of it's embarrassingly parallel). It typically takes about 73 minutes on the 2700X. I'm hoping it will be closer to 40~45 minutes on the big boy.

    Incidentally, at least for what I've done thus far the stock cooler is considerably quieter (subjectively) than it was on the 2700X. But again, that likely wasn't full load.
     
  9. rlk

    rlk Notebook Evangelist

    Reputations:
    132
    Messages:
    565
    Likes Received:
    296
    Trophy Points:
    76
    It took 46:10, which works out to about 57% improvement, or about 5% per-core.

    I noted all-core boost to around 4.0~4.1 GHz (starting around 4.1, gradually falling to 4.01'ish), and one core at one point showed 4.6 GHz (by means of running cpufreq).
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2019
    jaybee83, hmscott and ajc9988 like this.
  10. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Super Moderator

    Reputations:
    2,537
    Messages:
    9,567
    Likes Received:
    4,977
    Trophy Points:
    431
    Welcome to HEDT. Personally I consider above 6 cores entry level of that. AM4 now at 16 cores is into the mid range of it, actually not too long ago this was the top end of HEDT. Computationally for the most part the 3900x meets the 1950x and the 3950x bests it.
     
Loading...

Share This Page