(Part 2) If U Can Solve This U R King

Discussion in 'Gaming (Software and Graphics Cards)' started by Unhappy User, Nov 27, 2017.

  1. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    Then why are you still wasting time here? We also - including you - told @Unhappy User there was nothing wrong with his laptop before he RMA'd it.

    He even toyed with you all and said he wanted to change his username to HappyUser, then a few minutes later complained about performance again, and here you all are days later spinning over it all still.

    You can spin it however you want, there are no performance drops by undervolting, proven by hundreds of people I've seen and likely 10k's of people overall - hopefully even more, not just me.

    You can p&m about 1-2 points drop, but it's nothing but the OS background load playing with the single core score.

    You do know when idle and 1 core is active the boost is higher than with background tasks loading the other cores and bringing down boost across all cores. That's your difference.

    When you are running multi-core the load is constant across all cores, and there won't be variation by background tasks starting and reducing clock and performance.

    Again, your a novice, there's no shame in it, but instead of spinning it off, listen and learn.

    Try a higher undervolt, that's the next undiscovered land for you :)
     
    Prototime, 0lok and macmyc like this.
  2. Unhappy User

    Unhappy User Notebook Consultant

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    You are a toxic person hmscott. All ur smiles and words of wisdom are fake and hide a wicked character. Please leave.
     
    Phoenix likes this.
  3. Danishblunt

    Danishblunt Notebook Virtuoso

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    Not quite, before he RMA'ed it I told him his performance issues were not caused by the CPU, but by the GPU, namely the pascal problem, he RMA'ed it annnnnddd suddenly we got new GPU in the system. Seems MSI agreed with me on this one.

    He wasn't toying at all, he was happy that his system would finally run again with his old performance.

    And nobody cares about your oppinion, we observe and conclude with observations, if 3 users with the same CPU observe corresponding to the undervolt worse performance in single core, then we conclude that undervolting will worsen the single core performance on undervolt.

    We don't substitute reality for wishful thinking such as you do.

    So yeah, you're a deluded novice, congrats.

    Sorry but I had to laugh at this. It made me picture a dude trying to sell people a box of poop while claiming it has something nice in it while smiling with an evil smile and quoting some stuff from fortune cookies. (yes that's my image of hmscott now thanks to you)
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2018
  4. Vasudev

    Vasudev Notebook Prophet

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    @Unhappy User aka Happy user: You can stop benching your PC and enjoy gaming and other stuffs why you bought the PC in the first place. Then fiddle with it and perfecting every tweak in the book/google to get max performance.
    Like I said your Silicon quality is better than mine. I just circumvented it by repasting/repadding correctly.
    W/o those my cpu hits 98C instantly, ask Papusan.
     
    Prototime, Papusan, 0lok and 3 others like this.
  5. Unhappy User

    Unhappy User Notebook Consultant

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    Vasudev i agree. It just happened that i had been relying on an upoptimized game to assess the performance of my laptop, which is BF3. Thanks to Semmy's suggestion yesterday i tried BF1 instead and witnessed optimal performance with stable 99% GPU load, posted here. And after CB r15 is yielding a consistent 680cb there is nothing more i can ask for. Other than understanding how it increased to this level on its own.

    For future readers and before the thread gets locked, I am now posting a final summary post of the solutions that worked.
     
    Vasudev likes this.
  6. Falkentyne

    Falkentyne Notebook Prophet

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    Undervolting is only required because of VID BOOST. It's not because of the chips being overvolted by Intel. Its because of the cancer Bios...You're basically undoing the VID BOOST in a VERY ungraceful way but you need to check for WHEA CORRECTABLE ERRORS in hwinfo64 and windows event viewer when undervolting. Because light load or idle may become unstable.

    The proper way to fix this issue is to set IA AC DC Loadline to 1 (5 can help reduce some vdroop with very very low VID boost) in your MSI Bios and then set a positive voltage offset if this causes any BSOD or WHEA correctable errors. But most people don't have access to this setting. You can donate to svet to unlock your bios for you, or you can unlock it yourself with the guides @Paloseco , @sirgeorge and others have posted by disabling the Bios Lock key (hard part) then dumping the bios APTIO region with FPTW64.exe -d biosname.bin -bios, unlocking the menus, then flashing the aptio capsule back with -f.
     
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  7. Falkentyne

    Falkentyne Notebook Prophet

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    They reach -140 to -150mv because that almost completely eliminates the VID boost of about 120mv from the 1.80 mOhms of resistance (IA AC DC Loadline=Auto). But you have to watch not only for full load bsod/crash, but also for idle crash and WHEA correctable errors (I believe these errors are the cause of performance drop).

    For those with an unlocked Bios, removing the undervolt TOTALLY, and overriding the AC DC auto setting with AC DC Loadline=1 will most likely give you the exact same temps and power draw reduction, WITHOUT affecting idle stability.
     
    hmscott likes this.
  8. Vasudev

    Vasudev Notebook Prophet

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    How did you update MEI FW w/o MSI official patch? Will enable ME FW reflash and enabling Local ME update do the trick? And how to toggle Admin user,extended user in Aptio V using AMIBCP?
    So where do you set AC DC loadline?
     
  9. Falkentyne

    Falkentyne Notebook Prophet

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    Msi patch is just easy mode.
    I used the win-raid raw firmware file and the intel FWupdate flasher.

    https://www.win-raid.com/t596f39-Intel-Management-Engine-Drivers-Firmware-amp-System-Tools.html
    I think I got this one for PCH-H

    http://www.mediafire.com/file/72311a1dpnc3y3x/Intel+CSME+Firmware+v11.8.50.3426+(CON+H).rar and Intel CSME system tools 11.4 (Now up to 11.6).

    But this is for brave people. I think you get PCH-H version. But there may be third party modifications that may make this method have issues. It worked fine for my GT73VR.

    Are you trying to unlock your bios?
    IA AC DC loadline is in "Intel I/A Core Domain", usually in some "Power and Performance" submenu.
    For menus just set them to supervisor in AMIBCP.

    Biggest problem for unlocking bios is NEVER EVER EVER EVER try to unlock officially downloaded Bios, because this contain more than just the APTIO capsule. Since you're only editing the "user space" (APTIO capsule), and official Bios has APTIO, ME, boot block, EC sometimes, UEFI all together, that can result in an instant brick.
     
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  10. Unhappy User

    Unhappy User Notebook Consultant

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    This is a summary post that recaps the set of solutions that solved my original problem with MSI GT62VR. It has been a great learning experience for me. The process covered 5 key steps:

    I. Replacing GPU and Cooling Components:
    The laptop was sent to MSI for warranty service and MSI performed the following:
    - Replaced my GTX1070 with a new one
    - Replaced the entire cooling module (2 fans, all heat pipes and heat sinks) and repasted the CPU and GPU
    - Formatted the system and installed a bloated version of windows 10 which I later tweaked using Phoenix's guide.

    Results posted here: Temperatures went down by 15C-20C under heavy load. Also witnessed better scores in all 3DMark and Heaven benchmarks. However, Cinebench R15 and Battlefield 3 multiplayer witnessed no improvement.

    II. Activating Dual Channel Mode:
    Next, I installed a second RAM stick to enable dual channel-mode. I added it in easy access slot #2, in addition to the existing stick in hard-to-access slot #3.

    Results posted here: The minimum and maximum fps in BF3 increased by +20fps, avg. by +8fps. All 3Dmark scores increased, especially the CPU score component. No change in Cinebench R15 score. No change in Heaven.

    III. Downloaded latest version of Cinebench R15 (v15.0.3.8)

    Result posted here: First run of the multicore test yielded a higher score of 660cb. Older version used was 15.0.3.7 and consistently yielding 648cb-650cb after applying latest INTEL ME FIRMWARE PATCH which reportedly slows down the CPU by 1%-3%.

    IV. Undervolted by -100mV using Intel XTU:

    Results posted here (multicore) and here (single core): Cinebench multicore score increased to 674cb, it seems that before the undervolt the CPU was reaching its max TDP @45W during the test making it throttle and score only 660cb. After -100mv, power consumption was ~42W during test, and no throttling. However, the single core score decreased to 126cb. I did not spend time to further calibrate the undervolt and find the sweet spot that increases both scores. I did not test gaming during the undervolt since the CPU clocks were not throttling anyway in BF3.

    V. Mysterious Part:


    I removed the undervolt. I updated Realtek HD Audio driver to v6.0.1.8318. Cinebench R15 now consistently scores 678-681 on multicore @41Watt, and 147 on single core. The reasons behind this surge in performance are not yet clear.

    VI. GPU Load Test:

    I installed BF1, Mass Effect Andromeda, and the witcher 3, and the GPU operates @99% load in all 3, contrary to BF3. Hence it is a game optimization issue and not GPU issue. Recording of BF1 can be found in this post. All graphics scores in benchmarks and framerates in games are normal and as expected, except for BF3.

    VII. Acknowledgements:


    In order of appearance:


    Thanks to @Danishblunt for helping me overcome my historical fear and overclock my GPU for the 1st time in my life and witness its impact on performance

    Thanks to @yrekabakery for posting the insightful videos showing the impact of Dual-Channel mode in multiplayer shooter games

    Thanks to @Vasudev for his friendly attitude, positivity, and patience while supporting me throughout the entire thread

    Thanks to @macmyc for spotting my Single-Channel RAM mode in BIOS and patiently sharing his scores and settings from his laptop

    Thanks to @aaronne for taking time to install and test BF3 for me when needed

    Thanks to @Papusan for his patience, continuous support, and helping me realize my CPU was reaching maximum power limit during CB R15 multicore test, and helping me overcome my historical fear to undervolt my CPU for the 1st time

    Thanks to @Phoenix for teaching me how to reset the CMOS without opening the case, for his Macrium Reflect video guide, and for his Win10 Clean Installation Guide

    Thanks to @Falkentyne for his wealth of knowledge on RAM and overclocking which enriched the discussion

    Thanks to @Semmy who saved the day by proving that dual-channel can be activated on MSI GT62VR by inserting one RAM stick in 2 different Banks/Compartments, and for his patience to read and write long posts in a foreign language
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2018
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