1. You may have noticed things look a little different around here - we've switched to a new platform (XenForo) and have some new forum styles and features. This how-to guide will help you find your way around. If you find anything that looks strange, post it in this thread.

OFFICIAL Statement regarding the Sager NP9260 (Clevo D900C/D901C) Quad Core Information

Discussion in 'Sager and Clevo' started by paladin44, Jun 11, 2007.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. paladin44

    paladin44 Company Representative

    Reputations:
    4,715
    Messages:
    7,219
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    206
    This is the OFFICIAL Statement regarding the Sager NP9260 (Clevo D900C/D901C) Quad Core Information:

    THE LATEST UPDATE ON THE QUADCORE IS NOW LOCATED AT http://forum.notebookreview.com/showpost.php?p=2286998&postcount=40

    "D900C: Blue Case
    D901C: Black Case (Sager NP9260)


    We want to explain to our customers the reason why we are not using the Q6600 Quad Core processor in our NP9260 unit, and why modifying your unit by adding that processor will void your warranty and release Sager from all liability relating to the malfunctioning of the unit.

    While Sager does its best to bring leading technology to our customers, we can not ignore the lab test result from Clevo.

    Per Sager’s request Clevo has conducted multiple tests to determine whether the Q6600 Quad Core processor is usable in the current Sager NP9260 (Clevo D901C Black color). While the system will accept the processor and boot up, due to hardware specifications it will cause system failure if used long term.

    While you may have read that the Intel X6800 and the Q6600 are very similar in thermal and wattage, that is not the case. Reports showing these similarities have not been run in real life applications and uncontrolled environmental conditions.

    The fact is:

    Intel X6800 is a 75 watt sku
    Intel Q6600 is a 105 watt sku

    This puts the Intel Q6600 Quad Core 30 watts over specification. This can increase by an additional 10 to 15 watts under extreme max load conditions. This wattage increase brings additional heat and often will be combined with environmental temperature. A few benchmarks simply do not show the real world long term effect on the system.

    Rest assured that we are constantly working to use the latest and greatest technology in our units. And we have requested Clevo to continue working to enable Quad-Core functionality. However, we are also committed to providing our customers with a product that will work reliably in the long term. In this case, using the Q6600 in the NP9260 would not accomplish that goal."
     
  2. Exatrive

    Exatrive Notebook Consultant

    Reputations:
    3
    Messages:
    103
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    30
    WOW.. thats impressive. Now thats what I call Quality Control and True Inhouse testing.. Plus that will keep RMA's down.. but thats still cool.
     
  3. Gophn

    Gophn NBR Resident Assistant

    Reputations:
    4,843
    Messages:
    15,710
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    455
    Thanks Donald for the official word from Sager.

    The math seems correct.

    In any case, the Quad Core Q6600 is technically compatible in the D900C.... however the question of long term stability and use from any excess heat or power consumption is hard to find an answer to.

    I have been doing the math (power usage) for this unit when it first came out.

    :GEEK: My interpretation: :GEEK:
    The notebook was originally designed to have:
    -- CPU: desktop Core 2 Duo/Xtreme
    -- HDD: up to 3 internal
    -- Videocards: up to dual SLI-mode videocards (using new modular design)

    The notebook now:
    -- CPU: compatible with Quad-core Q6600 (approx 30-40 more watts than X6800)
    -- Videocards: (though not official through Clevo yet) new enthusiast Geforce 8M's (8700, 8800, etc...) have been discussed at Computex that shows a 22W+ envelope... which would make it plausible to be used in the new [next-gen] Clevo notebooks.

    Therefore (theoretically)... If you were to use a single videocard (giving you an extra 25+ watt buffer) and use the Quad-core Q6600, the system would theoretically be healthy for long term use. I cannot say for having SLI and the Q6600 together since the math shows it pushing the envelope.

    In any case, this notebook should still be considered the world's first Quad-Core notebook... making it faster than it was initially perceived. :notworthy:
    EDIT: though it may be the first Quad-core supported notebook, its does not seem to be recommended from Sager... as well as from myself.

    These are all unofficial interpretations, but I have been pondering about this for quite some time now..

    Final Thoughts:
    Glad to see that Sager has stepped up to show their concerns as well.... I would like go along with their recommendation and also say that its not a good idea to use a Quad-core CPU in this notebook.

    Thanks again Donald.

    -Gophn
     
  4. paladin44

    paladin44 Company Representative

    Reputations:
    4,715
    Messages:
    7,219
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    206
    Gophn...please re read the notice and possibly amend your comments.

    "...we are also committed to providing our customers with a product that will work reliably in the long term. In this case, using the Q6600 in the NP9260 would not accomplish that goal."
     
  5. Justin@XoticPC

    Justin@XoticPC Company Representative

    Reputations:
    4,191
    Messages:
    3,307
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    105
    Sager prepared this statement not only for resellers but for our review of the 9260 that will be posted in the next 24 hours. We have experienced issues with the Q6600 during our testing and will be posting the details of shortly...
     
  6. pyro9219

    pyro9219 Notebook Deity NBR Reviewer

    Reputations:
    371
    Messages:
    1,407
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Thanks for the update Donald, glad to finally get a truthful word about the topic with enough detail so hopefully people won't challenge why the decision stands.

    Some people *cough*Gophn*cough* :p might still be pushing for support early though. :D
     
  7. pyro9219

    pyro9219 Notebook Deity NBR Reviewer

    Reputations:
    371
    Messages:
    1,407
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Can't wait for your review! Thanks Justin :)
     
  8. Gophn

    Gophn NBR Resident Assistant

    Reputations:
    4,843
    Messages:
    15,710
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    455
    I know I know, I am just enthused about stuff like this.

    I already added the EDIT about this notebook is not being recommended for Quad-core use.

    Maybe Clevo will release a new revision that will give more power ... *grunt* *grunt* *grunt* :)

    Here's hoping for a true Quad-core notebook... can't wait to see Clevo's version of the D900C for the AMD Phenom X4's.
     
  9. paladin44

    paladin44 Company Representative

    Reputations:
    4,715
    Messages:
    7,219
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    206
    That is not surprising that you are having difficulties Justin.

    What everyone should keep in mind is that:
    1. Even if you just run a single GPU does not mean that the thermal (heat) dissipation necessary for the CPU could be "deducted" from that which the GPU is not generating. The Quad will still over stress the CPU area's thermal capability in hot conditions (summer days, Middle East desert etc.) when under heavy gaming or engineering use.
    2. The 22 Watt estimate of the video is not supported by nVIDIA or the laptop manufacturers. Paper specs are rarely accurate in real world conditions and applications.
    3. Even IF the 22 Watt is accurate (which is highly doubtful) it does not take into consideration the transistors and capacitor on the GPU board, or the memory wattage which when all added together could take it up to 45+ Watts.
     
  10. Charles P. Jefferies

    Charles P. Jefferies TG Lead Moderator Super Moderator

    Reputations:
    13,747
    Messages:
    34,812
    Likes Received:
    558
    Trophy Points:
    531
    Thanks for posting this information Donald. I really don't see much of an advantage to quad-core processors right now - if you need that kind of power, you should be looking at a desktop system anyway. If the X6800 isn't powerful enough then I don't know what will be. ;)

    Very much looking forward to your review Justin.

    I'm currently typing on a Clevo D900C myself and I have to say, it is an awesome machine. :cool:
     
  11. paladin44

    paladin44 Company Representative

    Reputations:
    4,715
    Messages:
    7,219
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    206
    Gophn, we appreciate your enthusiasm, and you can rest assured that Sager/Clevo will continue to bring us more and more power with each new generation. :D
     
  12. pyro9219

    pyro9219 Notebook Deity NBR Reviewer

    Reputations:
    371
    Messages:
    1,407
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Add a *grunt grunt* from me as well for when quad's will be official!

    Unfortunatly, the software just isn't there for really utilizing that kinda power :(

    That, and first generation quads (Intel's atleast) are scoring lower then dual cores because of the bridge latency between the twin cores. These things are really shining only in transactional system's and a few other smaller more specialized markets. I don't honestly see mainstream support till at least 2010 at this rate when looking at how long we have had dual core processors and comparing the application support on them. (I think that statement makes enough sense, might edit later for clarity but in hurry :D)
     
  13. DFTrance

    DFTrance Notebook Deity

    Reputations:
    317
    Messages:
    754
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    30
    Next year we will have Quads all over the place with the new architecture from Intel to be launched in the end of this year IMHO (at least in desktops). Overall the new architecture is more efficient in power consumption and heat generation. As far as I read and understand it it will be just enough to fit into a box such as the one of D900c, but it will require the P35 chipset at least on board. But yes we have to wait and see, I would not buy a Quad for gaming at the moment anyway for the reasons Pyro posted.

    Trance
     
  14. Ice-Tea

    Ice-Tea MXM Guru NBR Reviewer

    Reputations:
    476
    Messages:
    1,260
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Goph,

    Using a single GPU doesn't help relaxing the CPU's limits. The power converters are most likely not the same, I don't even think they share the same fan(s). So this basically only flies for the power brick..
     
  15. Charles P. Jefferies

    Charles P. Jefferies TG Lead Moderator Super Moderator

    Reputations:
    13,747
    Messages:
    34,812
    Likes Received:
    558
    Trophy Points:
    531
    I have made this thread a sticky so as many people as possible see this.
     
  16. pyro9219

    pyro9219 Notebook Deity NBR Reviewer

    Reputations:
    371
    Messages:
    1,407
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Good Idea!
     
  17. ltcommander_data

    ltcommander_data Notebook Deity

    Reputations:
    408
    Messages:
    1,398
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    55
    The "solution" to the quad core problem would be to build a Xeon based notebook that uses the 50W 1.86GHz L5320 quad core Xeon. Of course, the added heat and power from FB-DIMMs will probably cancel out the power savings from the CPU.

    The best bet would be to base it on upcoming nVidia Xeon boards which should be out by the end of the year, now that they have a Xeon license. nVidia's Xeon boards should use regular DDR2 or DDR3 rather than FB-DIMMs since they are targetted more at workstations than servers. The end of the year would also bring 45nm server Penryns (desktop and mobile versions likely won't be out until Q1 2008), but Intel will probably keep the same TDPs and push higher clock speeds rather than cutting power further.
     
  18. mujtaba

    mujtaba ZzzZzz Super Moderator

    Reputations:
    4,097
    Messages:
    3,080
    Likes Received:
    96
    Trophy Points:
    116
    I think the Sager folks should wait for the 45nm then...
     
  19. AtolSammeek

    AtolSammeek Tokay Gecko

    Reputations:
    204
    Messages:
    1,588
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    55
    I think it would be best to wait for a single Quad core cpu for laptops. To understand what I am saying take a look at this picture.

    http://images.tomshardware.com/2006/08/31/four_cores_on_the_rampage/quad_core_simple_view.jpg

    Basicly it a quad core. But what intel did was put two E6700 65 nm 4MB cache dual core at 2.66 GHz chips to make a K6400 with two 4mb cache = 8mb cache. With a laptop the two core 2 glued together is going to be overkill and be to hot.

    Remember when Amd frist came out with a dual core. They where smart to make it on one chip. Intel was in a rush to match Amd and glue two P4 together then seid it was dual core. It took untel Core 2 to come out and we see the benifits of a ture dual core chip. With Less power useage and faster chip.
     
  20. Derq

    Derq Notebook Evangelist

    Reputations:
    30
    Messages:
    362
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    30
    yea thats why it's called core 2 quad , and not quad core
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page