Official Gateway 78xx Series FX BIOS - 9c.05.00 thru 9c.17.00

Discussion in 'Gateway and eMachines' started by E-wrecked, Sep 25, 2008.

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  1. CodeHelmet

    CodeHelmet Newbie

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    Is this file still available @ another link? This one is giving a 404.

    I'm looking to downgrade my bios back to 9c 17 and cant find it anywhere. Need windows 64bit flash version. Hopping you can help.

    thanks!
     
  2. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Moderator

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  3. jmsigler2

    jmsigler2 Notebook Enthusiast

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    I upgraded my CPU from P8400 (OEM stock) to the T9900 on my Gateway P-7805u laptop with NVIDIA GeForce 9800M GTS with driver version Driver Version "9.18.13.1422" shown under System Information (MSINFO32.exe) | Components | Display (a.k.a. "314.22" with NVidia GeForce Experience service) and loaded Throttlestop with version "2.99.6", then a later version "6.00". Months later, I started to take some advantage of games such as a PC version of a Star Wars game. I then found my LCD laptop screen starting to go black or blank, video lost, at random points in time. Initially, I thought this might be due to power option settings or screen saver settings; no change in power option settings or screen saver settings appears to fix the problem. I wondered and still wonder if a virus could do such a thing at random times. But, Malwarebytes and Microsoft Essentials do not seem to find a problem. I am left guessing that this is an overheating problem. The black or blank screen problem now appears to happen when I am not playing games. I use an Extended Desktop monitor, the Gateway FHD2400, and awesome monitor made by Gateway prior to Acer's purchase of Gateway; this extra monitor, used in conjunction with the integrated laptop LCD monitor, makes the GPU hotter that if either monitor is used separately. I have used Thottlestop to turn down the speed of the CPU; I have "C States" checked, which I think lowers the CPU cycles when demand is less, and SLFM not checked, which I believe controls the bus speed as normal or half speed; my presumption is that this will reduce some of the heat. I have also tried playing with the voltage (VID) settings in Throttlestop; this may only regulate the CPU. If the voltage is to low, the system might blue screen; and the higher the setting the more heat is produced. I have set the voltage at "1.2125" at present, the highest allowable being "1.2625", the lowest allowable is "1.0500".

    In looking for a solution, my research came upon the thread "p7805u - Overheating GPU after BIOS update" ( http://forum.notebookreview.com/gat...p7805u-overheating-gpu-after-bios-update.html ). Currently, I have upgraded to "9C.23.00" which appears to kick on the GPU fan at 80C. In reading the thread "Kurt's P-7801u FX upgrades" ( http://forum.notebookreview.com/gateway-emachines/658716-kurt-s-p-7801u-fx-upgrades.html ), blogger Kurt appears to indicate that BIOS version 9C.20.00" has the same overheating problem, the fan not kick on until the GPU gets hot. Kurt goes on to say that BIOS version "9C.17.00" uses fan fluctuation to keep the GPU cool.

    I have seen Throttlestop report GPU temps reaching maybe 82C or 83C. I am not sure what the rule is for this BIOS. A blogger in this linked article mentions the same problem with BIOS version "9C.20.00". Another blogger appears to say that BIOS version "9C.17.00" keeps the BIOS GPU at or below 70C. I am concerned about going back to this BIOS since another site seemed to offer the opposite effect; so I do not know what is accurate information.

    I found another site P-78 black screen issue - hotfix only for 9800m gts - bios "9C.25.00" - EEPROM ID: (20,00ff) ( http://forum.notebookreview.com/gat...800m-gts-bios-9c-25-00-eeprom-id-20-00ff.html ) which appears to offer a patch to this problem. One blogger even notes having BIOS version "9C.17.00" and still has the black screen issue; so he is obviously interested in the hotfix or path for BIOS version "9C.23.00". However, the patch, according to one blogger, works only for Windows XP, not Windows 7/8. Then the same blogger later in the same linked thread says the BIOS patch for version "9C.25.00" does fix the problem. The website links are shown below. The only problem I see is having a patch or hotfix to BIOS version "9C.25.00", a version that Gateway abandoned issuing a recommendation at some point to roll back to BIOS version "9C.23.00", the version I am currently using. My Gateway knew about the overheating problem, but did not know what BIOS version it started in, so they did a quick rollback versus a hotfix, the inexpensive support cost way out. If this were the case, BIOS versions "9C.20.00", "9C.23.00", and "9C.25.00" may all have the same overheating problem. So, it would be interesting to know if the hotfix or patched BIOS version "9C.25.00" solves the overheating problem. If something else is wrong, other that with overheating and fan control in BIOS version "9C.25.00", then a hotfix or patch to "9C.23.00" might be more appropriate. And, maybe that is what Gateway did with it most recent published release of BIOS version "9C.23.00_A_A", dated on 2010/07/13.

    P-78 black screen issue - hotfix only for 9800m gts
    bios 9C.25.00 - EEPROM ID: (20,00ff) - Slic 2.1
    HotFix Bios 9C.25.00 Black Screen GF 9800m GTS Slic 2.1 Win7/8
    http://www.mediafire.com/?0q9tl16489tk1av
    HotFix Bios Black Screen GF 9800m GTS only for nvflash Win7/8
    http://www.mediafire.com/?3w5ylgg0bcdcbw0

    I hear "9C.17.00" had an open version of the BIOS which might have been created for super gamers using the X9100 overclocking CPU. Maybe also this earlier BIOS could have been an early release or test BIOS with a higher than normal fan speed algorithm. Newer NVIDIA cards now support fan control in the NVIDIA Control Panel which may be supported add-on software for some supported video cards. In my assessment, looking at NVIDIA System Tools with ESA Support ( http://www.nvidia.com/object/nvidia-system-tools-6.08-driver.html ), my video card is not supported.

    Gateway's official support site ( http://us.gateway.com/gw/en/US/content/drivers-downloads ) using Group="Notebooks", Series="P Series", and Products="P-78" provide the following BIOS:

    Category: BIOS
    Vendor: Gateway
    Description: BIOS
    Version: 9C.23.00
    Size: 4.6 MB
    Date: 2010/07/13
    Filename: BIOS_Gateway_9C.23.00_A_A.zip

    Currently, my computer has the following BIOS:
    Execute MSINFO32.EXE from the Windows run line for System Information
    BIOS Version/Date - Phoenix Technologies LTD 9C.23.00, 10/1/2009
    or
    Execute CMD from the Windows run line.
    Then, execute the following from the command line:
    Microsoft Windows [Version 6.1.7601]
    Copyright (c) 2009 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
    C:\Users\James>wmic bios get SMBIOSBIOSVersion
    SMBIOSBIOSVersion
    9C.23.00
    C:\Users\James>wmic bios get ReleaseDate
    ReleaseDate
    20091001000000.000000+000

    I already have BIOS version 9C.23.00 on my computer. But, I am not sure the release dates or posting dates for the current 9C.23.00 BIOS on Gateway's official website reflect the same BIOS I have on my computer now or a minor update. The filename currently posted by Gateway, "BIOS_Gateway_9C.23.00_A_A.zip" looks like it might be a minor update which could be tied the overheating problem; my assumption here in thinking there might be a minor update is the in the double "_A_A" after the version number of the BIOS; but after loading this BIOS from the Gateway official website the information is still reporting the same version and release date . And, Gateway does not provide detailed update information In the BIOS readme file. I am left to assume that I reflashed my BIOS with the same BIOS again. I also appears that the GPU fan becomes active when the GPU temperature hits about 80C.

    Then if the video continues to fail, the GPU overheating, giving a blank or black screen and requiring a reboot to regain video to the computer, I will likely look at a retrograde BIOS update back to version "9C.17.00" which supposedly uses fan fluctuation keeping the GPU cooling better for the system, especially for gaming.

    I assume this older BIOS "9C.17.00" is better for keeping the GPU very cool, but it likely consumes more power if it does work on fluctuation or runs periodically versus on demand when the GPU get hot. The new versions of the BIOS, as I understand it from other bloggers, looked at cooling the GPU on demand only when the GPU exceeded 80C. However, the newer BIOS version from "9C.20.00" forward appears to turn off the GPU or video card forcing the screen to go blank or black; and a reboot I find is the only way to get my video screen back until the next failure.

    I have also tried moving backwards from the latest version NVidia GeForce driver to driver version "9.18.13.1422". This did not appear to impact or fix the overheating GPU and Fan problem.

    The T9900 consumes more power at 35W @ 3.06GHz (http://cpuboss.com/cpu/Intel-Core2-Duo-T9900) as opposed to the P9700 which consumes 28W @ 2.8GHz (http://cpuboss.com/cpu/Intel-Core2-Duo-P9700). Maybe, there is a little bit of heat difference here between these two. I might tend now to recommend the P9700 over the T9900 if it will eliminate the black or blank screen video failures due to GPU overheating.

    Any enlightenment would be helpful before I consider possibly reverting the BIOS back to version "9C.17.00" which I believe many P-78 users have done. Since Gateway did a rollback from BIOS version "9C.25.00", using the patch or hotfix for the overheating GPU problem published for the P-7811 FX may not be the best safest way to go, even if the class of machine is the same as my P-7805u FX. I with more input from Gateway, I then might be am tempted to try a move to BIOS version "9C.25.00" and then apply the hotfix or patch for Windows 7/8 from the MediaFire link I provided above, already tried on P-7811 FX.

    Revised 04/09/2015

    I retro-uploaded BIOS "9C.17.00" to my P-7805u FX. I am still getting the BSOD even when not gaming, but I notice my BSOD is more prevalent when I conjunctively use an external Gateway monitor along with my laptop monitor. My guess is that I am putting more stress on the GPU. It is hard to know if the GPU is overheating or if power is an issue, or even if some IRQ problem exists. I do know that I have added the Intel T9900 which consumes more power than the P series CPUs. Maybe the P9700 would have been the better choice. I also have a RAID configuration running as RAID 0 with two Seagate Momentus XT drives. I am also using the MR15 with two SDHC SD Cards in the internal mini PCI-e port next to the OEM Wireless Wi-Fi mini PCI-e adapter. And, I have a PCI-e external adapter with two USB 3.0 ports too. Maybe power could be a problem at some level. I am about to upgrade to Windows "8.1". I do not expect that to fix my problem. However, maybe some new graphics driver could impact the GPU in avoiding the BSOD. I see a suggestion in this thread to updating to a P-79 series motherboard, as a new replacement part. I may consider that, if not start looking for a new machine. Outside of the fan control in the BIOS, I understand third party fan control software might exist to potentially prevent the BSOD; so I will look into that as well.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2015
  4. jmsigler2

    jmsigler2 Notebook Enthusiast

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    I found this official Gateway FTP site. A link on this thread or another thread allowed me access to the site below. I saved the URL but I cannot get into the P78 folder now. Maybe Gateway caught the security breach or the link I clicked on had some impersonation name and password which allowed access. This folder does have a number of BIOS versions to include "9C.17.00", "9C.20.00", "9C.23.00", and "9C.25.00", the last no longer supported by Gateway due to a rollback. Gateway is now posting "9C.23.00_A_A" if you look at the filename. Maybe, this is a minor update, hotfix, to correct the black screen reboot overheating GPU problem.

    ftp://ftp.gateway.com/pub/hardware_support/drivers/notebook/ <-- allows access
    ftp://ftp.gateway.com/pub/hardware_support/drivers/notebook/P78 <-- no anonymous login; requires name and password
     
  5. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Moderator

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    No one is sure of why the roll back, only that it happened. The black screen you are having is a memory timing issue. There have been various posts on getting it to keep from switching between 2d and 3d speeds but the idea is you have to keep it at 3D speeds. My guess here is 9c.25.00 tried to keep at 2D speeds even more often.

    The Idea this worked primarily for XP is because there is no Aero. Since no Aero the system requires switching between memory 2D and 3D speeds less often if not just avoiding it almost all together. As you can see there is a patte3rn here.

    The bios issue, well this is NVidia's fault. Early 9800m's were still unofficially subject to the solder issue. The P78xx series on the early cards could be subject to this. The thought was keep the card hot so that the temperature fluctuation would be limited increasing life span by slowing the cold joint effect. Now this will slow a card from dying but not prevent it. Now machines to consider possibly having this issue are early 512mb card like from the P7811's. Our late model 9800m 1GB cards should not be an issue. Memory timing is an issue for the cards across the board.

    My bios file has a collection of all the bios versions minus 9c.25.00. I had it but because I am not sure of the roll back issue(s) I deleted it! I no longer have a P78 board to test it on either. Just as well as it also creates the heat issue.

    My suggestions are;

    1.) get the bios to 9c.17.00, that 80c+ is will more damage than good over time on a P7805 GPU.
    2.) correct clock your T9900 and undervolt it if you can without any blue screen.
    3.) get rid of NVidia tools if you have them. Get rid of any profiles and the like as well.
    4.) Get MSI afterburner. Be sure here to select unlock and force constant voltage under settings (all three check boxes).
    5.) is GPU still tends correct clocked to run 80c plus then it is time for pulling it apart to clean and apply new TIM to the GPU. Unless you are running in a high temp ambient area you should only see high 70's under furmark etc. gaming even lower temps.

    Edit; as time goes on and you have proven the system stable again, then think of video overclocking but not before.
     
  6. jmsigler2

    jmsigler2 Notebook Enthusiast

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    Resolution to my Gateway P-7805u FX: (so far)

    1. I had already replaced the thermal contact layers for the CPU and GPU with Arctic Silver. About two or three months ago, I then purchased some thermal pads for the GPU, something similar to Arctic Silver and reapplied those after this problem with the black/blank screen overheating GPU or GPU driver crashing problem started. I was still getting temperature ranges from 66C to 82C. With Throttlestop, I would watch the temperature climb, the GPU fan would kick in, and the temperature would decline back to something in the upper 60Cs or low 70Cs.

    2. I have taken resolve to rollback to the Gateway supported Phoenix BIOS version "9C.17.00". With Throttlestop, and the laptop LCD screen and my external secondary Gateway FHD2400 monitor both active, the temperature range is now reporting MIN 44C and MAX 54C, and a fairly constant 52C right now. This is a night and day difference from what I was getting before. One blogger claimed that Gateway had officially claimed the temperature was reporting wrong on BIOS version "9C.17.00", hence one of the reasons for upgrading the BIOS. In any case, as opposed to BIOS version "9C.23.00", I no longer see the temperature gradually climbing like a did before; so I believe the fan is acting differently now, constantly, periodically or fluctuating, rather than acting only on demand when the GPU reaches 80C or above. I also do not hear my fan turning on loudly anymore, which always occurred when the GPU exceeded 80C. This appears to be great news! Maybe I will try some gaming again now on this system. Note: At this revelation, I believe I will stick with this BIOS through the remaining life of this laptop.


    Options I did not try:
    A. Hotfix posted for BIOS version "9C.25.00" on the MediaFire website, a patch version posted for Windows XP and another for Windows 7/8. Reason: Gateway abandoned the BIOS version "9C.25.00".
    B. A custom BIOS a blogger claimed to have designed to undervolt the GPU. I was not clear to me what BIOS was modified. And, there was some warning about altering the device id to something which could brick the ROM BIOS or computer requiring a BIOS replacement. -- This seemed like too dangerous a move to me.

    3. I do intend to play around more now with undervolting of the CPU in Throttlestop.

    4. I have no Performance Tools from NVidia installed on my Gateway P-7805u. From the NVidia GeForce site, it does not appear that they were supported for my NVidia GPU, model 9800M GTS, anyway.

    5. I will check into MSI afterburner. You mention, "Be sure here to select unlock and force constant voltage under settings (all three check boxes)." I am not clear on the benefit to doing this. More input would be nice.

    Thanks for the reply.
     
  7. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Moderator

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    When the system is running at lower GPU clocks the voltage changes over automatically to 2D levels. This voltage change is the leading reason for 9800m going to black screen. With MSI forcing voltage to stay up this cause is eliminated.

    Be careful with thin TIM's on the GPU. Since you were running 82c for a while it is easily possible it is already boiling out. Most GPU's do not run this high of a temp, The TIM looks at it as if you were running the GPU at high load the entire time. This is why I prefer ICD for machines like these.

    The are newer tools that work with the more recent drivers. MSI is the better option as you have a lot more settings to chose from. You have to unlock the control and then force the voltage for this too work.
     

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  8. jmsigler2

    jmsigler2 Notebook Enthusiast

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    TANWare, I will look into your advice on using MSI. Even though my temperatures show as 52Cor 53C in Throttelstop using BIOS version "9C.17.00", I just experienced another failure. You could be correct that I have sustained damage due a defect in hardware soldier to the GPU or to problem software in the BIOS or NVidia GeForce driver. If the solder on the motherboard was inferior, possibly with reduced or eliminating lead content, the soldier is becoming unstable after a number of years. Leaded soldier is more stable with heat. Maybe, the move to keep the BIOS hotter was by-design with release of BIOS "9C.20.00". I believe Gateway may have just wanted their laptops to make it passed their best 3-year warranty. Still, with the failure occurring again, I am now looking to your solution. I am also looking into the video driver as a potential problem as the GeForce Driver I have is Driver Version "9.18.13.1422", which is likely beyond what Gateway supported. And, my system has recently been reporting an event problem with one of my striped (x2) hard drives, a Seagate Momentus XT (HHD) ST95005620AS; so I need to back up soon. Maybe something with that drive, like a short, is triggering this video failure. I would have guess more at the blue screen of death in that case. Anyway, I need to check into drive replacement. I am going to start off with seeing how often this failure occurs.

    Update 04/09/2015

    I have warranty replaced my Seagate Momentus XT (HHD) ST95005620AS drives used in a RAID configuration a couple of weeks ago. ST500LX003 is the new part number of the replacement drives. I am using them in the same configuration. I would like to upgrade the size of these drives later, if not go to SSD drives. And, I would like to switch from RAID 0 (stripe) to RAID 1 (Mirror) given the cost of storage. I am a software engineer and I just cannot afford to lose anything. I do my best at backups too to external storage with a 4TB Seagate USB 3.0 external storage drive. I am still getting the BSOD, especially when using two monitors, the laptop monitor and one external monitor.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2015
  9. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Moderator

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    The drive, HDD, could be another issue on its own causing a black screen. I remember running a Raid0 and can tell you once thing to stay away from that can cause a black screen. That is letting the drives sleep, what happened was one drive was spinning up slightly faster than the other and the stripe would not initialize properly. I got a black screen every time. It could be running for a while but then because the drives were not being used it would put them to sleep. What a pain that was.

    It turned out the drives caused an IRQ lockup on the PCI buss. There was no BSD because the lockup was low level.
     
  10. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Moderator

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    Sorry did not realize you additional info. Gateways response on the temps reporting improperly on 9c.17 is not quite true. What is true is with 9c.20 and above the fans kicked in at the NVidia recommended settings for the card. This again, as you mentioned, was to try and get the card past that 3 year mark.

    MSI should be used instead of NVidia's own tools. It gives options to try and keep at the 3D memory speeds better. If you do not use the NVidia tools to overclock then just get the Afterburner just to keep the 3D speeds, it will prolong the card and make it more stable for you.
     
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