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Maximum safe temperature for i7 920?

Discussion in 'Alienware 17 and M17x' started by vulcan78, Jun 7, 2011.

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  1. vulcan78

    vulcan78 Notebook Deity

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    Playing around with SetFSB, at BLCK 160@2.2 Mhz and 5% OC 150 mv in BIOS I was running Crysis 2 "extreme" settings 1920x1200 and hit a maximum temperature of 94 C in Hwinfo32.

    I assume this is very high?

    GPU's registered 75 and 77 C max.

    Dialing it back to 75 mv and going to just limit the OC to 5% in BIOS.
     
  2. KillerBunny

    KillerBunny Notebook Evangelist

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    Anything over 90 on the cpu is definitely in the danger zone. Over 80 is where I get a a bit squeamish. Gpus are 90+ = bad
     
  3. Mechanized Menace

    Mechanized Menace Lost in the MYST

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    What he meant to say was that anything over 90 is in the D-D-D-Danger Zone!:D
     
  4. unclewebb

    unclewebb ThrottleStop Author

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    [​IMG]

    The Processor Hot signal does not go active until 100C. Intel says when that happens, "...the processor has reached its maximum safe operating temperature." The thermal shut down temperature to protect the CPU from damage isn't until 125C so 90C isn't hurting anything.

    vulcan78: Have you tried using ThrottleStop? Most 920XM users get their best results by leaving the BCLK at 133 MHz and then using ThrottleStop to adjust the turbo multipliers higher. You can also use ThrottleStop to adjust the Turbo TDP/TDC limits higher so you get more turbo boost when fully loaded. These are the settings that let you unlock the 920XM beast.

    Increasing the core voltage usually results in too much heat so your maximum overclock becomes limited by that.
     
  5. debaucher

    debaucher Notebook Deity

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    Agreed, keeping the BCLK at 133 and adjusting the turbo multi's with throttlestop gives me the best results on my 920xm (which I used for a week and am selling) and my current 940xm.

    Also, both the latest A10 and test bios will drop your bios OC back to default when your system goes to sleep, so it is useless for people like me (who actually use sleep/hibernation) when moving between buildings.

    As for temps, my systems typically have the cpu at 80-85c when I run folding@home for extended periods.

    I have yet to have my system throttle due to heat as I don't let my cpu get above 95c and only my 2011 mbp gets that high (91c) when folding.

    Now, my gpu's are a different story all together (rift gets my crossfire 8570's at ~84c each after a few hours of play even after the mods).

    D.
     
  6. vulcan78

    vulcan78 Notebook Deity

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    Thanks for all the help with this everyone!

    Ok I have throttlestop, but I am still confused a bit, i read your instructions in your guide, am I supposed to increase the multiplier of my 920xm from 12 to 13 and thats it? Could you please recommend some good settings that would improve the performance, not necessarily to attain high 3DMark scores for 15 minutes but to provide an enduring, optimal high performance tune that keeps the CPU temp below ~85-90 C?

    BLCK 133? So should I reduce the OC in BIOS from 5% to 0? With 5% im initially at BLCK 150 in setSFB if Im not mistaken.

    Also, should I revert the voltage back from 75 mV to the initial voltage in BIOS whilst using throttlestop?

    Thank you for the program, it is marvelous, and very selfless of you to go through all of the work with it!
     
  7. unclewebb

    unclewebb ThrottleStop Author

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    With a 920XM, the Set Multiplier setting in ThrottleStop should be set to Turbo. After that, you control the maximum turbo multiplier by clicking on the TRL button. This lets you adjust the maximum multiplier you want your CPU to use depending on how many cores are in the active state. Most M17xR2 bios versions have this set to 24, 24, 24, 24. If yours is set like this then you might want to try adjusting the TPL - Turbo Power Limits first. You can gain a significant amount of performance by increasing the amount of power your CPU can use but you need to keep a close eye on your core temperatures because more power equals more heat.

    I wouldn't use the 5% overclock while playing with ThrottleStop and you're probably not going to need the 75 mV voltage mod either. You should be able to gain more overall performance by playing with the TDP and turbo multiplier settings.

    You need to run a fairly consistent CPU dependent benchmark like wPrime when playing with these settings so you can get a better feel for how much you can increase the CPU performance. When wPrime first starts, you might need to hold down the shift key so it skips the hardware detection phase which is a little buggy on some computers.

    While wPrime is running, you will be able to watch ThrottleStop to see what multiplier your CPU is actually running at. At the default TDP/TDC settings, a fully loaded 920XM won't be running at the full 24 multiplier because of turbo throttling. Post some screen shots if you need some help.
     
  8. vulcan78

    vulcan78 Notebook Deity

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    Doing some searching I found an older thread here where a 920xm owner used the following settings with Great Success! (Kazahk accent)

    Ok, been playing around with Throttlestop to try and unlock full power of this fancy schmancy processor.

    Downloaded latest version, and had a quick look around the forums to see what I should set it it to. Saw a reference to TDP/TDC of 90/75 and set multiplier to 25 as an easy and quick overclock, so decided to try that first.


    http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-m17x/566829-m17x-r2-920xm-pasting-temps.html

    Ok so Im going to make the following changes:

    Revert to 0 OC and no additional voltage in BIOS

    monitor multipliers with wprime

    would the referenced TDC/TDP settings above of 90/75 be a good place to start?
     
  9. unclewebb

    unclewebb ThrottleStop Author

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    Would driving down a mountain with the accelerator pedal pressed firmly to the floor be a good place to start if you just bought a new car? Probably not.
    But it would be fun. :D

    I like to gradually overclock. Bump the TDP/TDC settings up a little at a time so you can watch how things go. When exploring, if you start too high, you can end up crashing and getting a lot of BSODs. You don't have to fully overclock your CPU all in one night. This is a hobby so take it easy.

    If you go in smaller steps then you can learn what works and what doesn't as you go along. If you immediately shoot for the maximum and don't make it, you'll be disappointed. You might also think that ThrottleStop is crap or you got a bad CPU when the real problem might be a lack of getting familiar with how these CPUs like to operate.
     
  10. vulcan78

    vulcan78 Notebook Deity

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    lol! Good advice, although I did use the above settings without checking back here first, thankfully my car and I are still in one piece.

    Results: TS Bench 8 threads

    32M-13.724 seconds
    1024M- 441.611 seconds

    Multiplier: 25x133.1 MHz= 3325.1 Mhz

    Max temperature: 91 C
    Idle Temp: 40 C
    Ambient Temp: ~65 F

    Wprime:

    1024M 376.403 seconds
    Max temp: 94 C

    Observations playing Crysis 2 in 1920x1200 extreme settings, performance similar, slightly better than setfsb but MUCH LOWER temperature, max temp: 81 C, Max GPU temps were also down a few degrees to 72 and 74 C.

    With the 5% OC in BIOS, 150 mV and BLCK 160 (2.2 MHz) I was running hot, again 94 C and for the GPU's 75 and 77 C.

    My pc would freeze up/shut off if I attempted to use setFSB without the additional voltage in Crysis 2 at BLCK 160.

    So yes this is an amazing program youve made, thank you very much, I will be donating via paypal as no-one should work for free.

    Do you think i can push this thing further, or should I just call leave it here? Would it be possible to run both 5% OC in conjunction with the existing throttlestop settings?
     
  11. faiz23

    faiz23 Macbook FTW

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  12. aarpcard

    aarpcard Notebook Deity

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    The 90's are hot, but not what I'd call dangerous. If it's flirting with 98-100, then I'd dial it down a bit, but lower 90's are fine.

    As for gpu's, especially laptop gpu's, the thermal operating limit is usually around 110 to 120C. I think the 4870's and 5870's have a limit of 115C. (I don't feel like looking it up, but from what I remember that's right). So 90-100C for a gpu while hot, also isn't a big problem. . . . If it were a desktop gpu, then yes, I'd be worried, because they typically have lower thermal limits.
     
  13. Emm3

    Emm3 Notebook Evangelist

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    While some of you are here on this thread can anyone tell me if there is a general 'safe' ovrclock for the 920xm? i just picked one up and its a keeper. a little extra speed wouldnt hurt :p
     
  14. unclewebb

    unclewebb ThrottleStop Author

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    While wPrime is running, does ThrottleStop show all 8 threads running at a solid 25.00 multiplier? That's great if it does. :)

    Instead of using the 5% overclock, why not see if your laptop can handle the 26 multiplier? You might also want to stagger it so it uses the 26 multi when 1 or 2 cores are active but drops down to 25 if 3 or 4 cores are active. The possibilities are endless so don't be afraid to play around. Your cool ambient temps really help out.

    I think as soon as you use the 5% overclock, the core voltage internally automatically goes up a little which creates additional heat. That's why many users get great results by adjusting the multiplier and TDP/TDC settings instead.

    You can also use the ThrottleStop Alarm feature to balance performance and heat. You could create one profile with a 90W TDP setting and then when the CPU core temperature gets up over 90C, you could have ThrottleStop automatically switch to a second profile with a lower TDP like 75W. This would allow the CPU to turbo throttle a little and keep the temperatures from getting too out of hand. As soon as the core temperature dropped below 90C, ThrottleStop would automatically switch back to your main high performance profile. With the dual profiles you can set up a more aggressive main profile without having to worry that on a hot day, you will be pushing things too far.

    Here's an example of 5150Joker running wPrime 1.55 with the 26.00 multiplier across the board.

    [​IMG]

    faiz23 is right. Time to move into one of the other threads so you can compare your settings and performance with other 920XM and 940XM owners.

    If you are only looking for a little extra speed then you bought the wrong CPU because the 920XM can provide a LOT of extra speed. :)
    With all 8 threads fully loaded, it can run 100% faster than a 720QM after a simple TDP/TDC adjustment and you can go faster than that once you bump the turbo multipliers up a notch or two. Amazing CPUs.

    You can get this huge increase in CPU speed even at the default voltage setting. Excessive heat and excessive voltage might kill the odd CPU but most users have pushed their XM CPUs to the edge of self destruction with rarely a problem. Keep the max temps under 100C and overclock away.
     
  15. Emm3

    Emm3 Notebook Evangelist

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    Its been a few years that i built my first desktop and i think i overclocked the cpu by cranking fsb i think? it was an e6750 c2d. To be honest all the talk of multipliers and other stuff has me hesitant to try anything yet. any threads that could enlighten me on oc'ing this sucker and explain all the terms etc? More speed is awesome for sure ! I guess running stock voltages and setting it as fast as it can go is enough for me. I have no need to push this thing or want to see high temps and any errors bsods etc.
     
  16. vulcan78

    vulcan78 Notebook Deity

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    Actually this thread is a great place to start if you want to OC your R2 the best way, if you go back youll see the results I got with using the OC function in BIOS and setFSB, I got really high operating temperatures in the CPU, I achieved similar if not better performance using throttlestop and ~10 degrees C less max temperature in games like Crysis 2 on high settings.

    I would re-read the information here and try some of the things I tried, they work pretty well.
     
  17. vulcan78

    vulcan78 Notebook Deity

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    I upped the multipliers from 25 to 26, leaving TDP/TDC at 90/75. Monitoring wprime v. 2.04 I couldnt tell if it maintained 100% at the given multiplier settings running a 1024M test, what data am I looking for? It completed the test in 371 seconds which I know isnt stellar. In throttlestop, the Cmod never dipped under 100% and the CPU's max temperature was around 91 C this last run on all 4 cores.

    Hmmm, would It be safe to up the TDP/TDC settings even further?!

    I like the idea of setting up a second profile to fall back on if the temperature exceeds a certain amount, looking at the instructions for how to accomplish this now.

    Thanks again.
     
  18. unclewebb

    unclewebb ThrottleStop Author

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    While wPrime is running, just watch the right hand table in ThrottleStop and see what the 8 multipliers are being reported as. The screen shot I posted shows the FID / Multiplier column reporting 26.00 for each of the 8 threads. That's just what you want to see. If you don't want to eagle eye the screen while a longer test is running or when gaming, just turn on the Log File feature. It will keep track if your multiplier is staying at 26.00 or if it is dropping down after a while. It also keeps track of C0%/Load and core temperature so you can go back and see exactly how your CPU was running during the bench. Post a ThrottleStopLog.txt file if you have any questions.

    Emm3: You can significantly improve performance without having to get too technical. Run ThrottleStop and click on the TRL - Turbo Ratio Limits button. The bios should have your turbo limits set to 24, 24, 24, 24 whether you have 1, 2, 3 or 4 cores in the active state.

    Close that window and open up the TPL - Turbo Power Limits window. Slowly bump both the TDP and TDC values up by 10 at a time until you reach a happy compromise between performance and heat. If you want your laptop to run significantly faster right now then pull a vulcan78 and set TDP to 90 and TDC to 75 and away you go. These two settings will give you a lot more Turbo Boost when the CPU is loaded.

    More Turbo Boost = Higher Multiplier = More Total MHz = Faster CPU

    Overclocking these CPUs is a lot easier than it used to be. You'll forget about your E6750 real fast.

    Head to the link faiz23 posted. It's full of information for 920XM owners.

    http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-m15x/520311-multiplier-manipulation-xm-processors.html
     
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