M17x R2 Most modern graphics cards supported?

Discussion in 'Alienware 17 and M17x' started by nforce4max, Aug 23, 2017.

  1. Raidriar

    Raidriar ლ(ಠ益ಠლ)

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    I would try to find later production examples of the 7970M from Dell, (usually those with the 022 vBIOS sticker on the back are later production cards)

    TDP is just a general guideline. 680M and 7970M have the same TDP, yet the 680M tends to run cooler under the same given load. tonga core (which the w7170m is based off) ran hotter than tahiti (7970m based of desktop 7870), so I would hold off on more heat especially in the m17x since the cooling was originally designed for 50-75W cards instead of 100-120W cards
     
  2. Danishblunt

    Danishblunt Guest

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    Go ahead, prove it. You have a 920xm + GTX 970M setup, which means you can run games like rise of the tomb raider, ashes of singularity, GTA 5, Crysis 3 and witcher 3. I'd want to see you play one or more of those games with afterburner and show your FPS.

    Oh you want a post that can help delude you with non factual crap. Sure let me help you.
    [delusion]
    The 920XM and 940XM are the pinncale of CPU's, it's a masterpiece, it won't bottleneck anything, it will even run with a GTX 1080TI and other high end GPU's for years to come. It's so powerful that one of these is 10000% faster than the best supercomputer on the planet.[/delusion]

    So for those tho don't want to delude themselves and are legit interested in buying the best they can get.

    [Fact]
    The GTX 970M gets bottlenecked by the 920XM or 940XM, in some games more than others. The CPU is simply way to outdated and cannot handle many games. It's not only about the clock, but also cache, architecture etc.

    Here are some practical examples:
    (1080p starts at 5:20min)
    Battlefield 4, high settings, 1080p
    gtx 970M, 940XM 3.5ghz
    min FPS: 47
    Avg FPS: 58
    Max FPS: 72

    Sadly there is no Battlefield 4 video where people only play on high settings, everyone plays on ultra. And notebookreview only did high settings BF4 on 736p. So I'll take ultra settings to get my point acress:

    Battlefield 4, ultra, 1080p
    GTX 970m, i7-4710HQ:
    min FPS: 55
    avg FPS: 62
    Max FPS: 80 (I won't count the FPS boost to 90s when looking up in the sky)
    (Sidenote, this was recorded with Fraps, unlike the other and still outperformed)


    Battlefield 1 Medium 1080p
    920xm @ 3.2ghz, GTX 970m
    Min FPS: 52
    avg FPS 55
    max FPS: 61

    High settings:
    min FPS: 44
    avg FPS: 51
    max FPS: 60


    Battleifled 1 Medium 1080p
    6700HQ, GTX 970m
    min FPS: 64
    avg FPS: 72
    max FPS: 78 (again, i will exclude map view that gives 90s FPS)

    Battlefield 1 High 1080p:
    min fps: 59
    avg fps: 64
    max FPS: 81 (again, exclude looking at sky or map) [/Fact]

    As you can clearly see, some people here are simply deluded and dislike looking at reality. OP can waste his money on a GTX 970M, I don't care, but I do care when people are misleading honest people who really want to know what the actual max non bottlenecked upgrade is.

    Also:


    Even the sandybridge is bottlenecking the GTX 1070. You should stop smoking, get back to reality.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 29, 2017
  3. Raidriar

    Raidriar ლ(ಠ益ಠლ)

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    920XM is not a masterpiece by any means, don't get me wrong, its old and inefficient and hot. If you read what I said, I stated that it will run up to a 1070 without bottlenecking and the effects start to be felt with a 1080. I don't own any of those games, but I ran a quick benchmark
    http://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/4824055

    and you can see my 970M performs near the top of its class in a given number off samples (in the 90th percentile of all 970Ms), not taking into account other 970Ms may be overclocked. Point is, the 970M runs perfectly fun with a moderately overclocked 920XM
     
  4. Danishblunt

    Danishblunt Guest

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    Are you trolling me? I even showed you a video where a 2700K is serverely bottlenecking a GTX 1070 and you claim a 920 won't bottleneck a GTX 1070.

    You clearly don't know what bottleneck means nor do you know any way of checking it. I literally cannot believe you're completely ignoring all the facts I presented and then make a random GPU only benchmark saying that your GPU is not bottlenecked. Of course the GPU doesn't get bottlenecked by a benchmark that doesn't test both GPU and CPUat the same time, duh.

    You need to run a benchmark that stresses the GPU and CPU at the same time. How in the world is a CPU going to bottleneck a GPU in a GPU only test, that's plain ridiculous. You have to run a game that stresses your CPU and graphiccard at the same time, like the titles I asked you to benchmark. I showed perfect examples of Battlefield 4 and the new Battlefield one, where you can CLEARLY see severe bottleneck in performance caused by the CPU.

    You have to be insanely ignorant to keep on saying that the 920XM doesn't bottleneck the GTX 970M despite having the facts right in front of your nose in a video format showing you the difference.
     
  5. deadsmiley

    deadsmiley Notebook Deity

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    There will always be a bottleneck. One component will always hold back another. Even a 7700K clocked to 5GHz will bottleneck a 1070 in certain situations.

    The people on this board are not smoking anything. I am pretty sure they know that when it comes to the M15x, the 1st Gen i7 is the weakest link even when overclocked. I know this, @Raidriar knows this. We know this. However, to say someone should pick a lesser card because the 920XM will bottleneck is not a good recommendation. Yes, GTX 970M will be bottlenecked in some games. Even so, it will vastly outperform just about anything else you can stuff in it. Bottleneck does not mean that once a certain level of performance is reached that it goes no further. In my experience it simply means that overall performance will be reduced across the board.

    One of the videos you picked has a user named "Marc m". He has another video showing the M15x with a GTX 970M messing over a 2015 AW 15 with an i5 and GTX 675M. I think that a 2015 machine with an i7 and GTX 970M would be much more fair of a test, but this is what he had. The upgraded M15x is still cheaper than the 2015 AW 15 by a LOT.


    In 2017 I would probably not buy an M15x and upgrade it unless it was just for a fun hobby. They are cool machines, but know their limitations.
     
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  6. Danishblunt

    Danishblunt Guest

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    It will get bottlenecked in almost all AAA games. Paying around 150USD more for a card to get in very few games slightly more FPS is plain dumb. On games like GTA 5, witcher 3, ashes of singularity etc the performance will be much worse and even throttle on a HD 8970M. Battlefield one is one of the best optimized games out there, and if you see a bottleneck there, other games will get far far far worse. I can tell that you do not play modern games on your M15x since you're not aware of the bottlenecks.

    Let's do an experiment, since you seem open minded, I got a GTX 970M on my P157SM with a 4940MX, you can get a GTX 970M or even use the Quadro M4000M, I'll then overclock my GTX 970M to GTX 980M performance, we can run various games to get a nice sample.

    EDIT: NVM, if you want to test the M4000M, I got an MSI notebook with a GTX 980M stock clocked, so we can use that one.

    Once you see how much more my system outperforms yours you won't ever recommend a GTX 970M over an AMD HD 8970M ever again,

    Also the video about the GTX 970M vs GTX 965M is not relevant, since synthethic benchmarks gives a very poor understanding on actual performance. it also mostly tests the GPU only, instead of a real combined setup, which you will see once we do the comparisons on several games.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
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  7. Arrrrbol

    Arrrrbol Notebook Deity

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    Would be interesting to see this done to show the effects of CPU bottlenecking.
     
  8. deadsmiley

    deadsmiley Notebook Deity

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    The Quadro M4000M is almost the same as a GTX 970M. The differences are 970M has 6GB VRAM with a 192 bit memory bus where the M4000M has 4GB VRAM with a 256 bit memory bus. Overclocking the memory on M4000M yields no gains. M4000M core clock is slightly higher with 975 versus 924 MHz for 970M but the Boost speed is lower at 1013 versus 1038 MHz. The biggest limitation to both of these cards is the low power limits in the VBIOS. Fix that and they really fly.

    Of course your system will outperform my M15x with the same video card. I already know that my M17x R4 with 3720QM is about 20% faster than the M15x with 920XM and the M4000M. I have done this comparison already not just in Firestrike but the games I play.

    I also know that a 8970M in either of these laptops is simply disappointing compared to the M4000M. This is based my experience in actual use of both cards in M15x and M17x R4.

    As far as testing goes, MechWarrior Online (Cryengine) and early versions of ARK are probably the toughest games I have run on the M15x. I have Witcher 3 but don't play it. I recently started playing PUBG, but not on the M15x. My M4000M that is in my M17x R4 will not run in the M15x because the VBIOS has been modded. I get a no boot situation when installed in the M15x. Flashing back to stock VBIOS does not fix this. My daughter-in-law has the only M4000M in M15x available to me.

    I too am after accurate information. It is true that most of the games I play are not AAA titles as I usually wait for them to go on sale through Steam which takes a while.
     
  9. Danishblunt

    Danishblunt Guest

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    for some reason I thought it was a M5000M, kinda get confused with those Quadro cards. They seem obsolete anyways. What modern games do you have right now? We can do exact test GTX 970M vs M4000M, you'll see that the difference in some games are up until 40%
     
  10. deadsmiley

    deadsmiley Notebook Deity

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    We would need something that pushes both the CPU and GPU. I am open to purchasing something for testing purposes. Suggestions?
     
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