LG Gram 2021 announced: 14, 16 and 17

Discussion in 'LG' started by RS4, Dec 16, 2020.

  1. RS4

    RS4 Notebook Consultant

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    I agree, very few people use numpad. LG should have made it Gram 17 exclusive as there is big space for it on the 17 inch laptop and let the 14 and 16 inch be with centred and big keys with sufficient space between them.

    Few grams extra on cooling and speakers will also make it a fantastic laptop, LG is constantly improving and maybe these things will be fixed in the future versions.

    Better screen with 500-600 nits peak HDR brightness is also needed as the current screen is stuck in-between with its saturated DCI P3 colour gamut but non-HDR screen with 350 nits brightness. So, you need to tonemap HDR to SDR for 4K HDR files but usually the media players also tonemap down to Rec.709 while Gram 2021 has DCI P3 colour gamut capability.
     
  2. skipper63

    skipper63 Notebook Consultant

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    I guess I am the lonely minority. If LG decided to ditch the numpad I think I will go for the 14 inch because weight and size are more important than a really big screen for me. I have the limit of 1.2kg in my mind as to what a laptop should weigh. Also the previous 13-14 inch versions lacked in specifications compared to the current one (I think in memory, lack of thunderbolt, etc).

    It totally agree that they should go for higher display brightness and I would prefer matte display but again there are many who use the laptop more for recreation purposes and prefer glossy.

    Now the few extra grams of cooling and the speakers is a big debate. I don't know about the quality vs weight for the laptop speakers

    About cooling, seeing how much they improved from the previous generation with very small increase in size of the heatpipe, I can assume that they have pretty much optimized their options with a single heat pipe and this super quiet single fan (the Gram is one of the quietest laptops in the market and this is also another issue to consider when discussing about better cooling). The competition around 1.6kg is getting more crowded and the Gram line is focused above all on weight. For most of the users a small improvement in the thermals will not bring noticeable gains in performance for everyday usage, but the weight disadvantage will be to the detriment of their marketing as the Gram
     
  3. RS4

    RS4 Notebook Consultant

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    I don't think most laptop makers test a lot in hot climatic conditions. I have 40 C outside and inside the AC is set at 26C.

    As you have finished all your CPU testing, can you do some testing on 4K HDR to SDR tonemapping and how it looks on this screen? Download some 4k HDR movies, you can use MPC HC/BE plus madVR, brightness can be set at 350 nits and colour gamut as DCI P3. https://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=259188&pid=2238949
     
  4. extremecarver

    extremecarver Notebook Consultant

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    Sorry - I am not very interested in color ballance - so I will not do it.

    Notebookcheck reviewed the 14". And strangely even though it consistently (except the NVME which is a better model - seems a newer series) performed worse than the 16" tablet they scored it way better... However it looks like they forgot to activate performance mode (max 30db noise from fan) - or the 14" performance mode is less fast fan? Or the 14" has less power allowance for the CPU/GPU vs the 16 and 17"? Could be that they just changed the PL1 to lower values? Maybe 14" PL1 = 22w, 16" = 25w, and 17" even higher? Just that with the horrible job LG does in production with thermal paste most people run into thermal throttling before even on performance mode (while if you repaste with a good thermal paste like Arctic MX5 - you will hit PL1 instead of the thermal limit).

    The 14" battery numbers are better too. I guess that is mostly because of missing the touchscreen. Or their 16" model did not enter C10. It is so easy to destroy C10 state by some software installation. Then especially the idle battery life is much worse. And their test also showed - screen brightness has not much to do with battery life. And strangely their unit has lower brightness in battery mode (300 vs 350 nits in the center). Guess they did not work out the details of the battery plan. Or I got around that by installing from scratch. That maybe is also why I have no difference in brightness with power saver on or off. Interesting that the 14" has a 1600:1 contrast ratio. 800 or 1600 is no good luck or bad luck. Their model is pretty recent (newer NVME). I am sure if you get a more recently produced model (check your bios version to know more or less when it was produced) they improved the panel.
    Sadly there is no revision numbers whatsoever for that panel.

    NBC WiFi Websurfing Battery Test 1.3 - 150nits = 14h 14min
    NBC WiFi Websurfing Battery Test 1.3 at max brightness = 300 nits = 11h 33min

    https://www.notebookcheck.net/LG-Gr...ce-and-finally-more-performance.541046.0.html
     
  5. hfm

    hfm Notebook Prophet

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    I think they typically will score the 14-15 inch laptops higher just because they are easier to shove in a backpack and travel with. Also could depend on who reviewed them but I didn't check if it was the same person.
     
  6. extremecarver

    extremecarver Notebook Consultant

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    yes - it seems so. The weight of the 16" is much more impressive than of the 14". 17" too (though a bit less - as the increase is about the same as going from 14" to 16" - the 16" has the smallest bezels and best screen to boy ratio - then the 14 has the least wasted space in the chassis). They did score the chassis way higher - is the 14" that much less flexible? if they added another rubber bumber in the middle below top of trackpad - then the 16" and 17" would nearly not flex at all while using. The rest of the flex is scary to look at - but knowing it is pretty sturdy does not matter.

    The weight seems not to e adjusted for screen size. The keyboard also scores better on the 14" - well I guess that is the numpad. The keyboard is identical - they just add the numpad on the side. But yeah that means not centered - that was actually the main reason for me to stick with 16" nd not order 17" besides prize. It is already really bad so out of center - but it will be worse on the 17". If they space the keyboard a bit wider - remove numpad I am sure on notebookcheck it would score 90 points for keyboard. The keypress itself is very good. I prefer it to the old 1.8mm keypress thinkpad T480s, but worse then the 2mm? T440s keypress/keyboard. That one was just ace. Then however they praise the battery life of the 14" but score it lower than the 16"... Haha does not make sense (but then I guess the 16" scores worse because they used the convertible and they do not account the scoring for convertibles.).

    And really strange the 14" speakers were so much worse. Hard to believe they are the same too, aren't they.


    And the written summary is also strange. They beat down on the 16" for CPU scoring higher than the 14" that they praise.. The 14" review summary feels spot on. The 16" they botched up..
     
  7. skipper63

    skipper63 Notebook Consultant

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    You should really stop taking too serious the scores they attribute. I have noticed long time ago how biased or careless they can be. Important is to read between the lines and retain the information that matters to you. The fact that obviously this reviewer missed the LG performance mode is a red flag. I think also the LG Gram 14 is the only small ultrabook with the option of a 2nd SSD, nowhere mentioned in this review.
    Your explanation of the difference in the keyboard score is also speculative from your part because you attribute weight to the centered keyboard which is nowhere in their criteria. it is just another subjective random scoring from their part, the reviewers of the 16 Convertible and the 14 are not the same. (By the way the i7 LG Gram 14 in their review is the leader by far in idle power consumption which contradicts your findings..)

    I like the reviews in notebookcheck for all the detailed information they provide and the relative stable process in all their reviews. But their scoring is another story. And I have the impression that they have become overextended, their reviewers do not exchange much information between them any more and their scoring becomes less and less valid.

    And a last word about flex on this laptop. If you are not looking actively to press and flex the laptop, it will not flex. I see what you say about the rubber foot below the trackpad or the middle, but unless you deliberately trying to press the case at the trackpad level, it will not yield. Under normal typing and usage the laptop will not flex. If of course you hammer type and press your hands on the laptop to get up from your chair than it will flex. This laptop is a huge improvement over the previous generation in terms of rigidity and it is amazing they managed to do this keeping the same weight while putting a bigger screen.
     
  8. extremecarver

    extremecarver Notebook Consultant

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    But their idle power is still above my notebooks i5 idle power - they get 37 hours out of the battery. I get 45 hours of idle battery life on the 16". At full idle the i7 and the i5 differ very little - that is because in C10 the cache is deactivated. However only in C10. For light load the i7 is not nearly as efficient as the i5 - and it is the light load that kills the battery life. It is not some short bursts of high consumption over a day - but all the light load. That is why the Macbook (Pro) M1 gets such a great battery life (even though I am sure besides the CPU the macbook is not as efficient as the lg gram). The ARM processors with big.LITTLE just shines on light workload. I guess it also idles at 1/3 of the power - but that is not so relevant. The thing is idle 45 hours - idle with 80% screen on still well over 20 hours on the gram. But then working actually it gets me 12-14 hours. So the CPU is by far the main consumer of power. The screen is quite far behind second.

    Seing Apple M1 and seing how efficient it is at light load - I would guess the next intel generation will just trump all the current windows notebooks battery life. Even if it cannot compete with M1, it will likely use only half as much power for light load. And then finally the IGZO display may be the biggest consumer again. If Intel got down to M1 levels - what I do not think - 24 hours battery life at 200 nits on the lg gram 16 with an 80wh battery should be possible. If it meets the current announcements then 18-20 hours. However likely that many manufacturers then reduce battery size?
     
  9. hfm

    hfm Notebook Prophet

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    I really like notebookcheck reviewes as well overall. I also think they are overextended as there are also a ton of typos, copy-paste errors and sometimes just wrong information in there. It's like they don't have a 2nd knowledgable editor or pair of eyes read it over while researching specs. I get it, it's a rough business and time is money, and I also think they do the best job overall at reviews, it could just be better. Just the simple fact that they have things like the sustained PL1 performance in there is alone a winner, not to mention so many other details. Their review score range is also really weird.. it seems like almost everything lands between 75-90%.

    I do exactly what you suggest though. I just go in for the facts and not necessarily the opinion part of it, and also take in other's findings and critique about the review itself or the product, and then consider the aspects of the laptop I actually care about and which aspects I'd be willing to compromise on.
     
  10. Steerpike58

    Steerpike58 Notebook Geek

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    Are you saying that I could plug my 2TB "SSD - SATA III 6 Gb/s, M.2 2280" into this thing? I currently have the Samsung ATIV Book 9 2014, which has two SSD slots, and it would be outstanding if I could just lift this from the Samsung and plug into the LG Gram!
     
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