LG Gram 2021 announced: 14, 16 and 17

Discussion in 'LG' started by RS4, Dec 16, 2020.

  1. extremecarver

    extremecarver Notebook Consultant

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    Yes it is quite useful - I use it too. That is the main reason to install the control center.
     
  2. extremecarver

    extremecarver Notebook Consultant

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    Repaste that cooler. I got around 10 degree drop in CPU temperature! I think I did not even do a good job - cause that Arctic MX5 was much harder than I thought. Should have warmed it up before so I can use less and spread it better. Compared to a full size CPU I am just not sure how much pressure you get with the screws - likely much less So I did not do the little drop method but tried to spread it. Factory job was way too much thermal paste. I think I now used about half as much (and it should be possible to use only 1/4 or so if you warm that paste up in warm water and maybe also make sure the CPU is warm before applying. I could guess there is another 3-4 degrees that I wasted because of doing a bad job (never repasted a laptop, only Desktop CPU). I was thinking I did such a pure job maybe not better than original and wanted to first just try what it gives and then open up again and do it a second time but better... Skipped that now.

    Now with 22 degree room temperature it runs around 85° on Cinebench 20 with 25W PL1 throttling with performance mode. With optimal cooling mode I still score 2020 points or so. Because of the PL1 power throttling (not thermal) max score is around 2150 in performance mode (only PL2/PL1 throttling with PL2 at 36W. After about 40-50 seconds it hits the thermal limit - then it can cool around 29w at 23 room temp.

    That heatpipe is a bit of a joke still. If the heatpipe would be 10-20g heavier I think the cooling would be another 10 degrees colder (from current). Still now I can nearly get the same performance on optimal mode that before I would get on performance cooling. That laptop is way quieter now and should save some energy as now the fan never runs for my normal worlkload. Never, ever..

    Websurfing - fan off, around 15-16 degrees over room temperature. So 38-39 degrees. Actually if you repaste the i7 could make some sense. That factory paste job is dirt poor. Wow how can LG miss that soo badly. Investing maybe 0.5€ more per laptop (by doing a proper job here with quality heatpaste) would net them 5-10% better scores in benchmarks in performance mode, and 10-15% better in optimal cooling mode. With a proper paste job the LG gram would likely have been labelled as near optimum performance for tiger lake (yes 2400-2500 points is possible with a higher PL1 than those 24-25w and instead going for 35w or so as some gaming laptops surely do). Then again the tiger lake H is the much better option than the i7. Either i5U or i7H - the i7U has no real reason for existence.

    I am not sure why before I was able to remove PL1 time limit, and now not...
     
  3. skipper63

    skipper63 Notebook Consultant

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    Yes I guess you do not need the F4 privacy mode, you do not need the F9 reader mode, you do not need to F8 for keyboard backlight and I guess everything else that the idiots at LG spent their time to develop.....
     
  4. extremecarver

    extremecarver Notebook Consultant

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    Keyboard backlight works without any drivers. Same as screen brightness change with FN keys (no I do not need any animation should there be). And yes stuff like the reader mode I really do not need and do not want. Also no privacy mode or whatever. If I need something special - I will get special software for it. If I had need for privacy, I would get a notebook with a real privacy filter - so you cannot look onto the screen from other angles (and I would hate that in many settings - love that the screen is very color stables from all angles and not only left/right but also top/bottom which is much more rare).

    As F4 and F1 are the only F key I use quite often (ALT+F4) and F1 for help, it is practical to not use those functions but remap them. That way I can have sticky FN key on, but still use the two functions I use often on the F keys.

    What works without drivers: screen brightness, touchpad on/off, flight mode, projector mode, keyboard backlight, volume keys. It's all mapped to default windows modes.
    Does not work. F1 whatever that is, F4 (privacy mode), F9 (reader mode).
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2021
  5. extremecarver

    extremecarver Notebook Consultant

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    BTW - I just weighted my lg gram 16 on two different high quality scales. One showed 1155g, the other 1157g - with a second NVME. The Gram 16 should be advertised at 1150g. (I am sure the NVME weighs 6-8g or so, did not weigh it but looked up some weights). It is definitely 40g lighter than LG claims. If they just invested 30g into a better heatpipe and another rubber bumper below the middle of the device - it would be a great improvement. (besides a brighter screen and getting rid of that junk numpad). And maybe 10g more for better speakers. And an additional 50g for 90WH instead of 79WH battery. Most important improvement would be a little less glare and 150nits brigher screen. So 500 instead of 350.
     
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  6. skipper63

    skipper63 Notebook Consultant

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    This is your opinion.

    In the past laptops of 15inch and bigger had always a numpad. Apple ruined it, putting form over function and then Dell copied them and slowly slowly the others. Now every Starbucks resident computer user is convinced that if the keyboard is not absolutely centered it is the end of the world. No it isn't and there are people who really use their computers to compute and need to enter a lot of numbers. Computers are not just for browsing the Internet or editing videos, or running Cinebench 10 times per day.

    If you don't want a numpad, you want bigger heatpipes you can get a DELL XPS. If you want a matte screen you can get a Lenovo. If you want better speakers you can get a Mac or Dell also.
    Or you can apply for an engineering job at LG and show to them how useless they were by not increasing by 30g their heatpipes.
    FYI most of the serious manufacturers understate the specs in their products so they will not have any customer complaint issues if they deviate due to normal manufacturing variances, in their processes or those of their suppliers. My i7 showed 1160gr.
    This is also why Porsche or BMW understate the performance of their cars and I am always impressed by the endless numbers of tuners who believe that they know better than the hundreds of engineers with the hundreds and hundreds of years of accumulated knowledge and experience in designing cars.
    In a similar way, LG is accumulating more and more experience in designing and manufacturing the perfect laptop in terms of compromise between weight, performance, form, keyboard etc. There are many supplier and design issues, many also linked to mass production that go far beyond the 30gr more of heatpipe.
     
  7. extremecarver

    extremecarver Notebook Consultant

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    It's mainly that the numpad is so squeezed - it has not much use anyhow. I'm faster typing with the normal number buttons. I just feel most people cannot type properly so they do not know where those numbers are without looking at their keyboard - hence they need a number pad even for small numbers. The problem is that the keyboard is simply too small - needs to be spaced out 1.5cm - and a bigger enter, delete and back button. I constantly miss the back and delete button - and I need those all the times.
    The heatpipe not for performance - but simply too keep it running colder on your lap. Yeah you live in Germany - right now since months it's freezing cold there - no wonder you do not care. But for people in warmer climates where 25-26 degrees indoors are the air conditioned norm most of the year - any degree counts. But yeah - repasting helps a lot already. The more heat going to the fan the better. Cause the hot location are those air holes. I have been thinking of a) closing them. b) opening up the holes over the whole length cause the place the processor is - is a hotspot.

    For me a numpad may save me 20 seconds at best on a day I type lots of numbers - a better spaced keyboard and less problems with the touchpad hit by my right palm would save way more time. I set sensivity to lowest - but still every day without a mouse move the pointer at least 10 times accidentally. E.g. thinking about what to write - instant disaster on the mouse if you do not move your hand away - cause you pause typing over 2 seconds..
    On lowest sensivity however the three finder or two finger actions become hit and miss. I really hate that numpad.

    And yeah I am thinking a lot about ordering a foil to self apply to cut glare a bit. But those foils can not match manufacturer applied foils. I do not want matte. I want a semi glossy coating. Or a less glossy, glossy coating. LG Gram is about the most reflective glossy notebook there is. Most glossy notebooks have way less glare.
     
  8. hfm

    hfm Notebook Prophet

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    I'm anti-numpad as well, I'd rather have the trackpad and keyboard centered, usually if there's a numpad at least one of them is offset to the left. I do understand that some people rely on it for their workflow. If it was a huge issue I would not have bought one, just personal preference. Though, if you want a centered trackpad and keyboard it's not possible to move it, but it is possible to add an external 10-key if you want one. So I'd say not having it is the more friendly option that would suit a wider audience.

    I'd also like to see them beef up the heat management solution, but that would come at the expense of a small amount of additional weight. The reason they are not taking advantage of the extra room in the larger units, especially the 17, is so they can save money by using the exact same board design and heat management design across the entire Gram line. Though on the flip side, if they allowed the CPU to consume more wattage by having better heat management it would add more asterisks to their unrealistic battery life claims of up to 19.5 hrs. Under what conditions is that possible? None that anyone will realistically use. Also the keyboard deck would get warmer than it currently does trying to sink additional heat intensity, though in practice that might not be much different for an extra 10W PL1 or something.

    I agree though, they probably aren't going to change these things as they have not for 3 generations of the Gram 17 now. So if they are deal-breakers get something else. It's nice to pontificate and dream though about changes that could make it better in someone's opinion. Opinion being the key word.
     
  9. extremecarver

    extremecarver Notebook Consultant

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    Yes if people buy it for gaming or such things - a better heatpipe would be making the notebook warmer. For people sticking to the normal workflow - it would make it colder. That heatpipe is still tiny and super lightweight. The one in my t480s is like twice the weight. Also better heatpipe equals fan spinning less often - so it would prolong battery life for the same work done. I think the current heatpipe is maybe 20g? Cannot measure it alone and it is attached to the fan - so I did not weigh it. But it really is tiny. Beef it up but stick to the current fan. Would help a lot. Well and making the screen less glossy, and putting that one additional rubber bumber in the center would get them way better reviews - everyone critisizes the glossyness of that thing. And for 2-3g of another rubber bumber you get that thing flexing half as much in real life. That is a huge win. I mean I do not know why the front rubber bumpers are flexy in first place... If you need a numpad - get an external one. While a full keyboard is bollocks for travel and use (cause you would be further away from the screen while typing. A numpad can just be placed besides your notebook when you need it.

    I just bought an armada of bluetooth speakers - guess that is the best solution anyhow. That tiny echo dot 3rd generation is pretty nice for traveling. If only it could use a USB-C power supply instead of proprietary one. Sound quality beats any notebook by miles (without being good).
     
  10. skipper63

    skipper63 Notebook Consultant

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    At home office the Gram is connected to the eGPU which is also connected to another Thundebolt dock. A USB soundblaster card connected with SP-DIF to my home cinema sound system. When on the road I use my Sonys WH-1000MX3. In case we want to watch a movie at an Airbnb and there is no smartTv we connect it to the TV with HDMI.

    In the past, when I was travelling with my Vaio, I was always carrying an extra Numpad (This Vaio had also a French keyboard, for anyone knowing, you need the Shift key to type numbers....). I had bought plenty and none satisfied me. The Logitech one needed a small dongle, was almost 300gr but had an excellent feeling. Another one with bluetooth was too shallow. On top, I had always to find a desk, I could not use it on my lap while waiting in an airport lobby. With the Gram 15 I was so happy, I never looked back and my numpads gather dust.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2021
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