Is the miniDP port also a Thunderbolt on a Clevo P751 P751DM2-G?

Discussion in 'Sager and Clevo' started by zws, Nov 19, 2020.

  1. zws

    zws Notebook Enthusiast

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    Hi folks!

    I have a Clevo P751 P751DM2-G bought in 2017. It says it can output on 4 displays. It has 2 mini Display Ports and 1 HDMi port on the back and I am guessing I can use one of the Type-C USB3s (which is a Thunderbolt 3 combo port) for the 4th display.

    But I am more interested if one or both of the mini Display Ports on the back can work as inputs as well. So the question is: Are those mini Display Ports also Thunderbolts? I have a Blackmagic design UltraStudio Mini Recorder capture card that has a Thunderbolt port as an output. It does not work out of the box so I don't know if it's missing some drivers or the mini DP is actually not Thunderbolt.

    Thank you so much for all your help!!
    zws
     
  2. Meaker@Sager

    Meaker@Sager Company Representative

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    I don't think DP supports both being an input and an output. The mini DP are not thunderbolt.
     
  3. zws

    zws Notebook Enthusiast

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    Hey, Meaker! I know mini DPs are not Thunderbolts per se. But they look the same. I just needed to know it the model has the thunderbolt function available for that specific model.

    As an example, the same clevo I have has one out of the 2 USB3.1 (Type-C) ports active as Thunderbolt. Only one of them is like this. The other is not.
     
  4. Stooj

    Stooj Notebook Deity

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    It is not. Mini-DP ports were only used as Thunderbolt 2 ports a long time ago They were superseded by Thunderbolt3/Type-C a long time before the P750 series came along.

    AFAIK, no modern laptops have Display-In capabilities as that would require some form of capture device built-in or passthrough the internal display (assuming you wish to use the laptop panel as a monitor).

    For your P751DM2 the ports are as you describe, 2x mini-DP, 1x HDMI and 1x Thunderbolt 3, all outputs. However, assuming it uses the dame display routing as the older P750DM-G, then the Thunderbolt 3 port actually shares output with Mini-DP #1.

    When the marketing materials refer to "4x monitors", they're actually referring to the internal LCD as one of those, plus 3 external monitors.
     
  5. zws

    zws Notebook Enthusiast

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    Thank you for your input, Stooj.

    I am afraid I do not understand this part:
    Related to the Thunderbolt port, here is what it said on the site I bought the laptop from:
    - One USB3.1 Gen2 / ThunderboltTM 3 combo port (Type C)
    - One USB3.1 Gen2 (Type C)

    So this is why I was guessing that the 4th display would be out of the USB Type-C Thunderbolt. I will definitely try this once I get my hands on an adapter.


    Here is a block diagram of the system. On the upper left corner you have the Display related part for anyone interested. [​IMG]https://ibb.co/98VwTJf
    Interestingly enough, I see that one Display port (PortA) comes out of the PS8330B + PS8338B chip) while the second Display port (PortB) comes out directly out of MXM3.0 Socket besides the HDMi port. I do not know what that means exactly. Are they different? Or is it what you said that I can either output via PortA (miniDP) or via the Thunderbolt (USB Type-C)?

    I will make a last test and afterwards I will sell the device. :/

    If you have anything to add concerning the last comments I made, please do.
    Thank you!
     
  6. Stooj

    Stooj Notebook Deity

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    Your original post says "But I am more interested if one or both of the mini Display Ports on the back can work as inputs as well.".
    The answer to that is no. DisplayPort input is basically a video capture device or video switch.

    First thing, the PS8330B+PS8338B is a DisplayPort Switch. It takes 1 signal and sends it to Displayport A OR Thunderbolt 3 controller. You cannot get display out of Thunderbolt 3 and Display Port A at the same time.

    2nd thing. Each line coming out of the MXM3.0 indicates a single video channel. Nvidia GPUs may have as many channels as the manufacturer wants, however, you can only have 4x active monitors at any time.
    Note: eDP and LVDS are both Internal Panel connectors.

    So your display options are:
    1. Internal LCD + HDMI + Display Port B (mini-DP) + Display Port A (mini-DP) = Thunderbolt3 display is disabled
    2. Internal LCD + HDMI + Display Port B (mini-DP) + Thunderbolt 3 = Display Port A is disabled
    However, there is a way to get 4x external monitors by using Display Port Multi-Stream Transport (MST). This lets you daisy-chain 2+ monitors together from a single DisplayPort, or use a MST Hub.
    Many high end Dell Business grade monitors have this built-in (I personally have one at work). e.g Dell u2520d has Display-Port Input (from your computer) and Display-Port Output (goes to your next monitor).

    My work setup is:
    • HDMI 4K Display + Display Port B -> Dell u2913WM w/MST -> cheap 1080p Display + Thunderbolt 3 4K Display = Internal LCD disabled (closed), Display Port A disabled.

    Alternatively you can get something like the Startech MST14DP123DP MST Hub. This does 1x DisplayPort (in) to 3x Displayport (out). Keep in mind, your display bandwidth is divided. So that hub can only do 3x 1080p@60hz, or you can do 2x 4K@60hz, etc. You cannot do 3x 4K@60hz.

    So you can then have:
    1. Display Port B (mini-DP) -> Startech Hub -> 3x Displays + Display Port A = HDMI, Thunderbolt 3 and Internal LCD disabled.
    2. Display Port B (mini-DP) -> Startech Hub -> 2x Displays + Display Port A + HDMI = Thunderbolt 3 and Internal LCD disabled
    There's many combinations you can have with an MST monitor or Hub.
     
  7. Meaker@Sager

    Meaker@Sager Company Representative

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    I would have though a pair of 1440p 60hz displays would be possible too from a single dp channel.
     
  8. zws

    zws Notebook Enthusiast

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    Wow, Stooj! Really a lot more then I asked for.

    Thank you so much for this invaluable information!!
     
  9. Meaker@Sager

    Meaker@Sager Company Representative

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    It's still pretty usable, you just have to be aware of what it can and can't do.
     
  10. Stooj

    Stooj Notebook Deity

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    Indeed, I just couldn't be bothered listing every possible combination as we'd be here forever ;)

    Things do get hairy one you involve high-refresh-rate monitors though. For example, I can run 2560x1080p@60hz + 1080p@144hz using MST. But I can't add another 1080p@60hz to that as it drops out. There are calculators available to see what the maximum bandwidth and resolutions could be, but I've also found that cables play a part in that.

    Also worth noting, things like G-Sync/FreeSync don't work when they're on the end of an MST link. The 1080p@144hz panel I use is definitely G-Sync Compatible (FreeSync) when directly connected, but that functionality doesn't flow through to the host.
    This could have major implications for anyone who intends to use MST when gaming with multiple G-Sync monitors (all 3 people who might use a laptop in a triple-monitor Sim Rig for example :p).

    No problem. It's an interesting problem that I've run into myself and hopefully it saves some headaches for others.
     
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