Intel-TongFang QC7 (Element/Fusion 15/MAG-15/Vapor 15 Pro)

Discussion in 'Other Manufacturers' started by B0B, Sep 2, 2019.

  1. elgreco14

    elgreco14 Notebook Enthusiast

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    This laptop (XMG fusion 15) looks like a great replacement for my Alienware m15 r1. What I am curious about. In fan mode 1 of intel @XMG what is the temperature threshold for the fans to turn on. In battery mode and in power outlet mode.

    Currently my alienware m15's fans wont turn off if temperature is higher than 40C on battery and connected to power outlet they never turn off. I really want a laptop which is more slick, less gamery, better keyboard feedback (m15 has only 1.2mm travel...) and great fan curves for simple desktop use.

    To bad the upgrade is only 2070 max q. (450 eur upgrade) I wish they had 2060. Im leaning towards the 1660ti now, but it's 10% less performance
     
  2. XMG

    XMG Company Representative

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    I currently have no reason to believe that the GPU Temp Target of this model will be increased in the near future. Intel was quite clear to us that the GPU Temp Target is how Intel is controlling the system and skin temperature under load. They have certain maximum temperature levels under their regulatory regime and they validated this laptop to be compliant even in ambient temperatures as high as 30°C. Think Singapore or a hot Australian summer without A/C.

    We at XMG have already traversed this discussion with Intel in-depth since beginning of June when we started scrutinizing our early working samples. During this process, we came up with the concept of reshuffling the performance profiles as explained in my post above. Those settings were originally not exposed. We worked to together with Intel to make sure that LOEM partners have more flexibility in how to build these profiles. During this time, we also modified Intel's fan tables early enough so they have since become the new, validated standard.

    So in essence, Intel has already come a certain way to accommodate our feedback - always provided that it wouldn't conflict with their validation limits (skin temperatures, system noise) in all thinkable edge cases. Based on what I've learned, Intel's cooling system is supposed to be able to run without fail for at least 5 years at full power, uninterrupted, 24/7. These kinds of considerations were the main driver behind Intel's R&D and their power/temp/noise balancing and this is what makes this laptop so special and unique.

    (The above is partially copied from our answers in this reddit thread.)

    I don't share this assesment. In our Enthusiast profile, the system is already performing beyond NVIDIA's standard Turbo Boost specs.
    In Balanced, the performance and fan noise are managed in a reasonable way, similar to what we have seen on other Thin&Light laptops. You will see more data in upcoming reviews.

    USB-C/DP can do G-SYNC and is fully recognized by the NVIDIA driver as a normal DisplayPort monitor. Thunderbolt has actually nothing to do with this. The DisplayPort signal is natively passed through. The same goes for all other USB-C/DP ports in every other NVIDIA-powered laptop in our portfolio.

    I can't speak for our friends in the U.S. but I'm 100% the same applies to the MAG-15 because it's based on the same motherboard, firmware and drivers.

    At XMG, will ship the XMG FUSION 15 with an included, passive USB-C/DP to DisplayPort (female, full-size) adapter so you don't have to look around the web for compatible adapters. The first batches will be shipped with this adapter - later we will switch to a different one from our own OEM source.

    That's all I can share today - have a good weekend!

    Cheers,
    XMG|Tom
     
  3. Shere Khaan

    Shere Khaan Notebook Enthusiast

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    Thanks for the information and conformation, Tom. Appreciate the official input :)
     
  4. Charles P. Jefferies

    Charles P. Jefferies TG Lead Moderator Super Moderator

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    It's not a problem to make B0B the original poster. Don't assume something can't be done; ask.

    Posts from this point forward must be on-topic.
    Move on.

    Charles
     
    yrekabakery and B0B like this.
  5. Prema

    Prema Your Freedom, Your Choice

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  6. IKAS V

    IKAS V Notebook Prophet

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    Prema you got a Vbios for this laptop?
    Did you get over the 75c GPU throttle limit?
     
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  7. Prerana

    Prerana Newbie

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    Thank you for this excellent news.

    I was hoping if you can tell that the battery of Fusion 15 will be compatible with XMG Neo 17? Both look like the same size but there could be a mismatch. And will this battery going to be available for purchase?
     
  8. dreamcat4

    dreamcat4 Notebook Consultant

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  9. XMG

    XMG Company Representative

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    PSA: I have updated my post about the System Power Modes by adding information about the location of these settings in the Windows Registry.

    After both CPU and GPU have reached their respective "Fan off" temperature, the fans will continue to run at 30% speed for 3 minutes and (if "Fan off" temperature is not exceeded again during this time) then power off.
    30% is very slow and will make sure to continue to cool down the mainboard and skin temperatures.

    "Fan off" temperatures are:
    Below 48°C for CPU
    Below 56°C for GPU

    These values are identical for all 3 fan tables.

    We can double-confirm that there won't be any RTX 2060 on this laptop in this generation.

    My pleasure!

    Since this battery is not plugable, it is unlikely that users will purchase spare batteries from the get-go.
    It will be a while before we start stocking spare batteries for this model.

    The 94.48Wh battery from XMG FUSION 15 does not fit into XMG NEO 15 or XMG NEO 17. Facts:
    • The battery needs 4 screws to be held in place. Only 1 out of 4 screws align with the FUSION battery position in XMG NEO
    • The 94.48Wh has more than double the z-height of the original batteries in NEO. Certain elements of the Top Case are would need to be chiseled away in order to make it fit.
    • With the increased z-height, the FUSION battery collides with the FFC cables for the keyboard and the right-side I/O ports
    Pictures:

    1) Top: XMG NEO 15 with official 62.32Wh battery installed. Bottom: disassembled 93.48Wh battery from XMG FUSION 15.

    [​IMG]


    2) Battery height comparison: 62.32Wh at the top, 93.48Wh at the bottom

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    3) XMG NEO 15 with battery removed. These pictures indicate which areas collide with z-height of 93.48Wh battery, including rubber blocks, plastic notches and floating FCC cables.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    (click pictures for full resolution)


    The situation on XMG NEO 17 looks very similar.

    Conclusion: We will not support this case modification and upgrade.

    If you make it work, you can connect the 93.48Wh battery to XMG NEO 15 and 17 - the polarisation of the DC cable seems to align. The battery is correctly identified and can be charged and dischaged by the system.

    Disclaimer: This combination has not been validated for safety and long-term usage. The charge and discharge mechanism of the mainboard might not have been calibrated for this battery. In the worst case it might result in serious damage, even up to thermal build-up, fire and explosion.

    We will not continue to test this combination due to these safety concerns. We seriously advice against doing user-upgrade with 3rd party batteries that are not officially supported by your system vendor.

    tl;dr: do not try this at home.

    Cheers,
    XMG|Tom
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2019
  10. dreamcat4

    dreamcat4 Notebook Consultant

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    Yeah you would have to make a whole new special bottom cover, that had a side profile something a bit like this:

    View of bottom cover
    From Right Side

    Code:
     Battery     Air scoop    Heatsink
    \_______/------------------_______|
    

    A prototype of this object could be 3d printed a few times, in order to get the right positioning for the mounts / screw posts / adapter clips etc.

    HOWEVER

    You would also need to check and make sure that the charging controller on the Fusion's mainboard (on the old laptop) was actually capable and compatible with the new larger 94wh batter. Since the number of cells / taps etc may be different. And / or the charging controller might need a new firmware etc.

    Another consideration to think about is that usually a normal 3d print for an object so thing and large as a new bottom cover would probably not be very durable. And prone to breaking. So it would either need to be made significantly thicker in places (over engineered). For lower quality print materials to be strong enough. Or otherwise do a final print it in a more durable material, for example by a service to another company, who has a better printer.

    So... a few obstacles to overcome there. But quite an interesting and fun project for someone. Assuming you could get the charging controller to work. And I'm not sure about that.
     
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