Intel Core i9-9900k 8c/16t, i7-9700K 8c/8t, i7-9600k 6c/6t 2nd Gen Coffee Lake CPU's + Z390

Discussion in 'Hardware Components and Aftermarket Upgrades' started by hmscott, Nov 27, 2017.

  1. jaybee83

    jaybee83 Biotech-Doc

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    important for us laptop folks ;)

    Sent from my Xiaomi Mi Max 2 (Oxygen) using Tapatalk
     
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  2. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    Not quite enough detail, I'm assuming he had that 9900k around for a long time and it's the old P0 stepping silicon, while the new 9900ks is the new R0 stepping silicon.

    Hopefully someone will compare 9900k R0 vs 9900ks R0, what someone buying a brand new 9900k/ks would get today.

    Check ur stepping and manufacturing code digits!! CPU-Z "Revision" if you already have it installed and lost the box... :)

    hixday93800 2 months ago
    "I just bought a i9 9900k 2 weeks ago how do I know if mine is a r0 please ?"

    Mappi75 1 month ago
    "On the box you will see: SRG19"

    Matthew Emery 3 months ago
    "Is there really a huge difference in capability between the P0 and R0 stepping? I just got my i9 9900k from Amazon and the S-Spec is SRELS on the package which means P0 I think. Wondering if I should send it back and get a newer one?"

    Overclocking Intel Core i9 9900K R0 stepping to 5.8GHz+ on Water Cooling
    Luumi
    Published on May 26, 2019
    On this short video I will show you how I test this R0 stepping 9900K in Cinebench and for max validation. During the video the CPU passes 5.4 in R15 with 1.34 set Vcore and validates 5.83GHz with all cores and threads with 1.5v set Vcore on ambient based water cooling. I use my 5.2GHz 4300CL17 daily profile as a starting point and work my way up in the OS.

    Key is in the temperatures as I previously managed to pass 5.4 with only 1.3v set and 5.5 with 1.38v set when temperatures were lower due to lower ambient temperature. Next step is to lap the CPU IHS to possibly gain a few degrees.

    Now I used HD PVR Rocket to Capture the video instead of filming the monitor.

    Hardware used:

    9900K R0 stepping
    EVGA Z390 Dark
    2x8Gb HyperX Predator 4133 CL19 @ 4133MHz 17-18-18-28 2T
    Galax 710 GT
    Seasonic Prime 1300W Platinum
    Kingpincooling KPx

    EVGA OC Lab forum for Z390 Dark tools and BIOS etc: https://forums.evga.com/EVGA-OC-Lab-f...

    Follow me at HWBOT: https://hwbot.org/user/luumi/


    And, don't forget to do a motherboard BIOS firmware update to support the R0 stepping - check that there is one for your motherboard before buying an R0 stepping CPU:

    Intel's New 'R0 Stepping' 9th Gen Processors Will Crash Windows 10 Without New BIOS Update

    And, be careful if you decide to "delid" your soldered 9900k/ks:

    I Got A Broken 9900K
    BPS Customs
    Published on May 19, 2019


    Pinned by BPS Customs
    oldmanian 5 months ago
    "I did make sure it was good prior to delid & I did use the Der8auer tool shown in the video. Wasn’t my first delid, but was my last delid on 9900k lol. I’d recommend Silicon Lottery or Main Performance PC for their delid services. Both do an excellent job in my experience. Thumbs up for the video in place of ‘F’ respects."
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2019
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  3. Talon

    Talon Notebook Virtuoso

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    Some Live 9900KS LN2 OC.
     
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  4. Talon

    Talon Notebook Virtuoso

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    Kind of old news at this point, but luckily a non-issue as you can still boot all previous BIOS with the new CPU installed and simply perform the update procedure via internet or USB.

    However, having spoken to motherboard and manufacturers MSI and Gigabyte about the issue is not. as bad as I'd feared. Unlike a generational update, where you may not be able to get into the motherboard of the EFI when using a new CPU and the old motherboard BIOS, this time it looks like you will be able to at least boot your PC and enter the EFI to update the BIOS with one of the new R0 CPU stepping-compatible versions.
     
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  5. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    Funny, I thought new 9900ks owners were complaining that they crashed in Windows without the update?

    Maybe it's only a Windows problem? Linux? You can get into the BIOS and do an update from there, and not go into Windows. Or use the USB "flashback" like features on some motherboards to avoid even going into the BIOS.

    This guy found problems with R0 vs P0...He also mentioned problems with the BIOS update with Windows 7...at least on his motherboard.

    "The BIOS (UEFI) has to be updated, but after automatic IME update Windows 7 might not work. (important for overclockers at HWBOT) (use flashback if possible - if not - you're screwed)

    R0 will not work with the same BIOS that P0 was achieving best scores. R0 will not work with same settings.
    "

    i9-9900k R0 revision OC Kitchen Full Review (worse than P0)
    Piotr Orkisz
    Published on Jul 24, 2019
    Well I really wanted this i9-9900k R0 revision to be superior and better.
    But it turns out differently.
    I had 9x i9-9900k P0 and now I have 2x R0.
    Hardware:
    Maximus XI Apex
    G.Skill Trident Z RGB 4600Mhz CL18 @3600 CL16
    Seasonic 1300W Platinum Prime
    Benchtable - OBT
    AIO: Phoenix MLC 360mm (Vardar 120mm x 3)
    NVidia GT 720

    i9-9900k @5.1GHz with AVX -2
    Same setting for all P0 chips - Vcore override 1.330V .
    Vcore with offset about 0.07V for R0.

    Yes, this video is long. Yes, it might not be funny to watch it.
    But if you're planning to buy i9-9990k, especially if you're thinking about changing your P0 to R0 revision - watch it.

    Conclusions for Enthusiast Overclocking (LC and air):
    R0 is worse than P0 because:
    It scores worse at same frequencies of CPU and RAM and same RAM timings.
    Temperatures are much worse despite lower Vcore voltage demanded by the chip.
    Even after delid temperature are worse than with some of P0 chips without delid.
    To run 3600MHz CL16 RAM VCCIO has to be much higher than with P0:
    P0 - Vccio 1.23V R0 - Vccio 1.29-1.32V

    The BIOS (UEFI) has to be updated, but after automatic IME update Windows 7 might not work. (important for overclockers at HWBOT) (use flashback if possible - if not - you're screwed)

    R0 will not work with the same BIOS that P0 was achieving best scores. R0 will not work with same settings.

    R0 is very sensitive to LLC (Load Line Calibration) and mostly it will demand higher Vdrop with non-AVX loads, but... (!!!) it will demand lower Vdrop with AVX loads - this makes regulation and overclocking hard: you may have stable profile for AVX loads which will be all the time BSODing with non-AVX loads and vice-versa.
    Vdrop observed is up to 150mV.

    At stock it is OK.
    Any OC and you have to be pushing Vcore almost 200mV higher.
    (even if Offset is only 0.070V (70mV) it will get to 200mV.


    Commentary from Luumi who had a better 9900k R0 experience, starts at 02:15:

    Intel Core i9 9900KF & R0 stepping 9900K - thoughts and opinions
    Luumi
    Published on May 18, 2019
    Intel recently released the stripped down version of the 8 core Coffee Lake 9900K to the market, the Core i9 9900KF. WIth same price tag it offers similar performance to the original model while lacking the integrated graphics.

    I managed to test one R0 stepping 9900KF binned from 3 pieces and also one random R0 stepping 9900K. The 9900KF really doesn't seem anything spectacular to me, eventhough some guys around the world have managed to find really nice samples for overclocking. Both the KF aswell as the R0 stepping 9900K work just like that with correct bios update on older Z170/Z270 motherboards like the Z170M OC Formula or Maximus IX Apex.

    R0 stepping as a whole seems very good and we may see even better clocking pieces amongst the R0 stepping CPUs over the coming months.
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2019
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  6. Talon

    Talon Notebook Virtuoso

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    Those findings form back in May when the R0 steppings started showing up are likely true today. Many R0 stepping 9900K will be the left over bins that didn't meet 9900KS 'standards'. If you're spending almost $500 on a CPU, spending another $50 is worth it to get a good chip out of box.
     
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  7. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    Spending $500 on the 9900k should be enough, shame on Intel for trying to screw their loyal customers for even more money.

    The 9900k has lost popularity, that CPU no longer deserves a premium price, Intel has had to drop the price, and so have vendors - now it's down to $471 and likely heading lower.
    https://www.google.com/shopping/product/7422097525384487285

    Intel needed to pull a fast one - find a new way to jack the price again to improve margins. Intel skims the best of their 9900k production to hold for a higher ransom - and the vendors can also pump up the price and generate buzz enough to stimulate sales.

    As everyone has said that has reviewed the 9900ks, it's not worth the extra money for 100-200mhz more performance that shows up under the *best* circumstances as 2%-3% improvement in games that favor Intel.

    Intel should be QC'ing it's production so that all the 9900k CPU's coming off the production line meet the same spec high spec for the $471.99 price.

    Intel has said the 9900ks is only a brief product release, gone before the Holidays, so until then I guess everyone's stuck with crappy R0 9900ks... at least until Intel stops skimming the "best" 9990k's to fill 9900ks orders.

    Does it seem right for Intel to skim the best 9900k's from production, leaving everyone buying 9900k's worse off?

    Maybe the right thing to do is to not reward Intel for pulling these shenanigans, and buy AMD instead? :D
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2019
  8. Papusan

    Papusan JOKEBOOK's Sucks! Dont waste your $$$ on FILTHY

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    Isn't this exactly as AMD did? Almost same chips but the higher binned one more expencive?:)
    The few KS chips Intel bin won't make the big extra margins.
     
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  9. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    And, nobody in the AMD world is recommending anyone buy those CPU's, we recommend buying the regular CPU - 3700x instead of the 3800x, 1700x instead of the 1800x, because the performance is not worth the cost premium.

    That's the difference. Why are you Intel guys falling for this scam? ;)
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2019
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  10. Papusan

    Papusan JOKEBOOK's Sucks! Dont waste your $$$ on FILTHY

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    The scammers is the shops/sales sites.
    upload_2019-11-12_4-32-17.png
    upload_2019-11-12_4-34-2.png

    -----------------------
    See also...

    AMD Ryzen 7 3800X vs. 3700X: What's the Difference?
    For this minor performance increase AMD has increased the MSRP by 21%, from $330 to $400, so the biggest percentage increase, if we ignore the TDP, comes from the price. And we believe that’s all you need to hear, you’ll get 3% more performance at best, by spending 21% more of your money.
     
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