HP HDX 9000 DRAGON Owners Lounge, Part 2

RickiBerlin · Apr 21, 2013

RickiBerlin said: ↑

As soon as news I will give publish it. Maybe I publish also the private messages of "triturbo". (of course only with his consent)
In this case, other users may pursue his Ideas and express their opinions, suggestions or changes.
Click to expand...

and "triturbo" agreed.....

I hope all the private mails are in the correct order. For me it is a bit complicated, because everything on english. Thus, it is generally for private messages. To read this you have to be logged in "notebook review". But just then does "Google translator does not." So I have to copy each email individually. Even my own.

I have our real names replaced by nick names. Sorry if this is private included. I can change it later.

So then ....

triturbo said:

Hello,

I don't know, if you are still trying, but I thought that this might be useful, if you don't know it already. Check 7738G's schematics, p.4 and p.5, you can download it from Kythuatphancung.com . I think that in order to work, soldering is definitely needed. There are parts in there that are noted QC (QuadCore?), also GTLREF is different.

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

triturbo said:

Hello,

While digging for Quad-on-PM965, I've found an old post of yours. I have the very same memory. How did you manage such high overclock, with standard settings? I can't change the SPD settings, as they seem to be locked. Have you changed the EPROM? Your input would save me from wasting another 200 euros. Thank you.

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

RickiBerlin said:

triturbo said:

Hello,

While digging for Quad-on-PM965, I've found an old post of yours. I have the very same memory. How did you manage such high overclock, with standard settings? I can't change the SPD settings, as they seem to be locked. Have you changed the EPROM? Your input would save me from wasting another 200 euros. Thank you.

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

Hello triturbo,

first, thanks for your messages! This made me very happy.
You know my posts so has you also, my English is very poor and most of Google translation.

Now to your question RAM:

The RAM has not changed. EPROM (original data)
The picture shows a hardness test and only served to limit determination.
I wanted to know if a flash "of CL5" "to CL6" is necessary and brings an advantage in terms of overclocking the T9300.

This was not the case, because the CPU voltage was before the limit. In my case, 1.2125 V. The system is unstable at 3.5 GHz due to the CPU voltage.
(the CPU voltage I did not raise by Pinmod)

A flash to RAM CL6 (with SPD Tool) did so no advantage.

Despite the stability of the CL5 memory of 333 to 430 MHz overclock this is beyond any tolerance and not to be recommended.

My applied overclocking is a maximum of 245MHz FSB, representing 3.3 GHz with the T9300 at 1.1750 V. (407MHz RAM)
See picture:

I do not know if your question is answered it?

Regards, RickiBerlin

PS: better course, the X9100 is no FSB overclocking see my results
Click to expand...

RickiBerlin said:

message 2

Hello triturbo,

sorry, of course you my contributions to the X9100 are known. You own this it myself.

Complement to the RAM:

I have many 4GB DDR2 modules. Nevertheless, only one module is flash capable. (Kingston)
This module (PC2-6400 800MHz CL6) I did my tests and flashed it to CL6, at 667MHz.
When installing two modules with different latencies always the higher latency is used by the chipset.
Example:
4GB PC2-6400 CL5 with at 667MHz +
4GB PC2-6400 CL6, at 667MHz =
8GB PC2-6400 with CL6 at 667MHz

If interested, here is a recent post in which you can see pictures of it.
In this paper, however, concerns a different topic.

A need of flashing did not surrender. So you do not need a flash-ready module.

triturbo said:

Hello,

I don't know, if you are still trying, but I thought that this might be useful, if you don't know it already. Check 7738G's schematics, p.4 and p.5, you can download it from Kythuatphancung.com . I think that in order to work, soldering is definitely needed. There are parts in there that are noted QC (QuadCore?), also GTLREF is different.

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link. Yes I still have all the hardware for the QC tests. At the moment I tests are not. With the ACER books I studied in this context quite often. Unfortunately, it never came to a meaningful result. Thank you for your suggestion, however!

Regards, RickiBerlin
Click to expand...

RickiBerlin said:

I forgot this link: "flash to CL6"

and other Values

just in case you ever want to flash. Otherwise unimportant.

good Sunday to you

RickiBerlin
Click to expand...

triturbo said:

Thank you for your answers, it is greatly appreciated. So my hynix is OK, for mild FSB overclock.

As for the Quad, I'm comparing mine (5920G) schematics, with 7738G, 8935G, 8530w and M4400. There are at least 15 different components, that have to be changed, and among those, it seems that only M4400 can accept both Dual and Quad Cores on the same board. Interesting enough "pin F8" seems to be Quad related on 8530w, M4400 and 7738G, BUT in 8935G it says NC?! It's a little nightmare I have to print them all and compare them. If you want a schematic, that you can't find, PM me, I'll try to upload it, but I'm on really slow connection

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

RickiBerlin said:

NC = no contact (this to be interrupted)

Yes, you're doing the same thing I did at that time.
Comparisons of ASUS with C2D and C2Q.
I compared the time nor HP EliteBook 8730w also.
This, there was also with C2D and C2Q. The bios and I compared the DSDT tables also.

It became more complicated and time consuming. So I stopped for the time being.

If you are still interested, then rummage in this thread to my former results.

If images such as v---- this ----v, no longer available in full resolution, then write me!

Click to expand...

triturbo said:

Vielen dank! That is exactly the image I was looking for

I see, so you don't want to deal with Quads anymore? Yeah, it definitely seems WAY too complicated. I'm just testing the ground, but I don't think that I'm going to do anything this half of the year. July, August... probably, but for now, I'll leave it So far the summary speaks enough to scare me - 1/ VERY custom BIOS 2/ A LOT of motherboard soldering (15 or more elements has to be changed) 3/ A handful of pin-modding... and 4/ only God knows, what else Thank you again for your hard work.

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

RickiBerlin said:

Maybe go to my "C2Q tests" more later.

Yes to all your points.

But if the point number 2 (2/ A LOT of motherboard soldering (15 or more elements has to be changed)

HDX true I do not know.
Perhaps no soldering required. No idea.

Here are a few files. Nothing really important. ca.20MB Password: "RickiBerlin"

Enjoy your tests and I'm always available.

Regards, RickiBerlin
Click to expand...

triturbo said:

Thank you, I'll check them tomorrow

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

triturbo said:

We need "3 phase" power, but we only have 2. In our case it comes from one controller, but with all quad-enabled motherboards I checked, it comes from one controller, which has sub-controller for each phase. It's a definite no-go (with all four cores) Unless you wire a new board and there solder all the necessarily stuff, it wont happen. I really hope that someone would prove me wrong though, but so far - no-go. That's what I've found for 4 days of digging. Good night, I'm going to take a nap

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

RickiBerlin said:

To your statement refers to this problem?:

Reading this thread "QX9300 Support For Sony Vaio Z11WN/B" (only two pages)
Please view image of "Meaker" on page 2!

and

see this one page! (my image is no longer visible, but that of "Bmac2020" yes it shows)

At least this requirement is available on the "HDX motherboard".

How is it with your board?

Or do you mean something else?

Best wishes and have a nice weekend for you! RickiBerlin
Click to expand...

triturbo said:

I've missed that It seems that you are lucky! I have to check your MoBo's schematics later (on phone right now), but it seems that you'll need very little modiffication on your board in order to work! Damn, The Dragon is awesome machine

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

triturbo said:

I don't know if you realize how lucky you are It's the first PM965 MoBo I see, that has 3rd phase! Well, you'll still have to change some components, but the most important part is there - 3rd phase. The phases schematic is 1:1 with 7738G If you want I can make you a list of the components that have to be replaced, but it would be later today.

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

RickiBerlin said:

Blessing or a curse, you can see as you like. Without this, I would have saved a lot of money. Because after all this information, I bought several "HDX Dragon" and "Q9200 + QX9300". (and more)

And all this time has engulfed. But it was also fun. Unfortunately, so far without success.

Nonetheless, I am grateful for any information. So if you have more information for me to be happy.

Too bad that you live so far away and we do not talk the same language. Otherwise, I would like to invite you to try and solder.

If you still need "Mohterboard pictures" or anything else, then write this!

For you and your motherboard, I'm sorry. (but who knows)

In conclusion:

Need we even more computing power? I think not. It's probably more fun tinkering.

And lastly, how old are you? I am about to die. (44 years)
Felt it remains hanging somewhere around 30 years old, only the mirror lies.

a beautiful Saturday to Teteven, Bulgaria

RickiBerlin

PS EDIT:

triturbo said:

If you want I can make you a list of the components that have to be replaced, but it would be later today.
Click to expand...

Answer twice, just in case :: YES, but take it easy.
Click to expand...

triturbo said:

RickiBerlin said:

triturbo said:

I've missed that It seems that you are lucky! I have to check your MoBo's schematics later (on phone right now), but it seems that you'll need very little modiffication on your board in order to work! Damn, The Dragon is awesome machine

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

triturbo said:

I don't know if you realize how lucky you are It's the first PM965 MoBo I see, that has 3rd phase! Well, you'll still have to change some components, but the most important part is there - 3rd phase. The phases schematic is 1:1 with 7738G If you want I can make you a list of the components that have to be replaced, but it would be later today.

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

Blessing or a curse, you can see as you like. Without this, I would have saved a lot of money. Because after all this information, I bought several "HDX Dragon" and "Q9200 + QX9300". (and more)

And all this time has engulfed. But it was also fun. Unfortunately, so far without success.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I know exactly how you fell It's always like this, most of the fun is in the researching and making it happen, than the actual need I have a ton of parts laying around as well.

RickiBerlin said:

Nonetheless, I am grateful for any information. So if you have more information for me to be happy.

Too bad that you live so far away and we do not talk the same language. Otherwise, I would like to invite you to try and solder.
Click to expand...

No problem. Since I have the data, why not to share it

I've used to be international truck driver, and I've been passing through Southern Germany very often, never got to Berlin, though. My German is very rusty as well I don't know how are your repair shops, but here in Bulgaria, everyone said that he "don't have time for this", even though, I will pay for the job. That forced my to buy soldering station and begin on my own I'm not very good, but it is OK for a newcomer.

RickiBerlin said:

If you still need "Mohterboard pictures" or anything else, then write this!
Click to expand...

That would be a very good start - high res photos of both sides

RickiBerlin said:

For you and your motherboard, I'm sorry. (but who knows)
Click to expand...

Thank you. So far - no-go. It would require A LOT of custom work, and even then I doubt that it's going to work, and I almost got QX9300. Thanks God, I've found out this, otherwise it would be pretty big investment for (currently) a jobless person. I'll check it again later on, but I'll leave it for now, hopefully we'll get yours up-and-running

RickiBerlin said:

In conclusion:

Need we even more computing power? I think not. It's probably more fun tinkering.

And lastly, how old are you? I am about to die. (44 years)
Felt it remains hanging somewhere around 30 years old, only the mirror lies.

a beautiful Saturday to Teteven, Bulgaria

RickiBerlin
Click to expand...

Definitely the fun

Don't talk like that, you're young and brave I'm 28, approaching 29 on the outside, inside - 13-15

Hopefully it would be beautiful, it was quite windy last few days, beautiful Saturday to you too

RickiBerlin said:

PS EDIT:

triturbo said:

If you want I can make you a list of the components that have to be replaced, but it would be later today.
Click to expand...

Answer twice, just in case :: YES, but take it easy.
Click to expand...

OK, I'll try to make it by later this evening

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

RickiBerlin said:

Hello triturbo,

Just a little "Thank you!" quite quickly.

I got a surprise guest, and therefore no time. Excuse me a lot!

I've read your messages. I'll get the day once again with you. Then also with photos from the mainboard.

All good so far ...

Regards, RickiBerlin
Click to expand...
triturbo said:
RickiBerlin said:

Answer twice, just in case :: YES, but take it easy.
Click to expand...

Here is half of the information, the other one is still all over the schematics. Take a look and tell me how it sounds to you
Code:
Point of your board - New element

R93 - 64.49R95.6DL

---
R570 - 64.17415.6DL 
There is SC1U10V2KX-1GP element on separate junction between R570 and AD26

R567 - 64.24R95.6DL
R568 - 64.49R95.6DL
R532 - 64.24R95.6DL
R531 - 64.49R95.6DL
---


between A21 and A22 - 64.10005.6DL  *It seems that on mine, and probably yours as well, there is no place to attach it.


F8 requires separate board for 9 elements and afterwards connects to D22
The last part is among the hardest ones. I was looking for high res photo of quad-enabled board, but no luck so far.

I didn't have as much time as I thought, so I'll leave the rest for tomorrow.

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...
triturbo said:
RickiBerlin said:

Hello triturbo,

Just a little "Thank you!" quite quickly.

I got a surprise guest, and therefore no time. Excuse me a lot!

I've read your messages. I'll get the day once again with you. Then also with photos from the mainboard.

All good so far ...

Regards, RickiBerlin
Click to expand...

OK, here it is, it might be a "bit" too radical, but that's the way I think it should be. There are few pins, from your picture, that I haven't mentioned, since I don't know yet if they are necessarily.
Code:
v0.2

5920G/Dragon

1) CPU

R79/R93 - 64.49R95.6DL

---
R364/R570 - 64.17415.6DL 
There MIGHT be SC1U10V2KX-1GP element on separate junction between R364/R570 and AD26 which grounds afterwards (8530W).

R367/R567 - 64.24R95.6DL
R366/R568 - 64.49R95.6DL
R48/R532 - 64.24R95.6DL
R43/R531 - 64.49R95.6DL
---


Between the copper paths from A21 and A22, you'll have to put "64.10005.6DL" - there are two test points on the back of my
board, don't know how it is for you. Found them with multimeter.

You have to cut the paths of AF7 and AE7 somewhere and connect the cut parts with 64.12115.6DL on each one.

AC8, AA8, D8 - isolate / 0R2J-2-GP (optional 7738G, not Quad related)

Isolate F8*, then put a wire, which goes outside the socket, there you have to make a small board which contains the 
elements from p5 (waiting QUAD CORE symbol) 7738G (or p7 M4400) schematics and afterwards connects to D22 (might require 
isolation*) with another wire.

*Requires isolation, as they are grounded on our motherboards.

---------------


2) North Bridge/NB - Test "1) CPU" prior this

R370/R533 - 64.16R95.6DL
R378/R528 - 64.75R05.6DL

---------------


3) ICH8M - ?

R268/R614 - 64.49R95.6DL
R475/R639 - 66.49R96.04L
Hope this was helpful.I'll copy M4400's element designation, as it seems more helpful than this (7738G). I might give it a go at some point, but not in the upcoming couple of months for sure.

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...
triturbo said:

Hello, RickiBerlin

I've saw your post today in the HDX topic. You can post the conversations no-problem, also thanks for crediting me It's just that the information is not ironed-out yet. I'm going to buy a laser printer by the end of this month, so once I have as much schematics as possible in front of me, I'll be able to say "This should be it". Bought the M6400's schematics, pins AA7, AA8, AC8, D8 are NC for Quad, so you have that one right and you can add them to the "isolate" list Pin F8 goes as usual through some elements to end in D22. The good news is that this schematic came with Boardview, and there I saw that this circuity F8~D22 has some space between it, so it probably is possible to take it outside the socket, without affecting the functionality. Also, some "little" bad news, it seems that there are 3 more points-of-interest around the North Bridge. I'm still pretty positive about getting it running The above modifications go for dual-core-only PM45 as well.

Regards, triturbo
Click to expand...

EDIT:--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Info picture below for download links from the EDIT:

EDIT 1: Download link updated in the text. Here is a copy of the link from:
"Schematic of HDX and EliteBook C2Q excerpts / PDF chipset PM45 and PM965 / PDF C2D and C2Q / images created base comparison and Other"

approximately 20MB (@ triturbo files you have already)

Password: "RickiBerlin" (without the quotation marks, but large and small letters note)

EDIT 2: Motherboard images about 50MB. (Nvidia-MB, ATI-MB and comparison between the two)

+ NEW DOWNLOAD HDX MB ATI version without black film <---- click

I have made an effort, but I'm not a photographer. Nor did the best camera. I hope the pictures are ok.
Perhaps another user can make it even better.

EDIT 3 to EDIT 2:

The image "SAM_3186.JPG" indicates an ATI heatsink with Nvidia graphics card on a "HDX Nvidia motherboard".
To recognize the lack of heat sink area in the GPU memory area at the bottom left.
This motherboard serves me for testing purposes only. (8800M GTX / GTS, FX3700M, C2D and C2Q)
I have created the images only as addition and comparison.

EDIT 4: following posts on C2Q on PM965 (used for summary)

triturbo said:

triturbo said: ↑

Today I'll try to update the part list with more user-friendly component designation.

About the phases, it seems that they "split" the load, means, only one is working at a time. With only 2 phases (5920G) the load on each would be 50%, where with 3 (Dragon) it's 33,3%. At least they have some kind of cooling (the CPU heatsink covers them). The 3rd phase definitely improves overall stability and probably the overclockability. Whatever, as soon as I sell some of my spare parts, I'll jump on the SS PM965Quad board

I've attached a file that might be useful. The last couple of pages have components list, which would help us to find a source for the ones we need. The other way is to get a quad-enabled MoBo

View attachment 95182
Click to expand...

triturbo said: ↑

I'm trying to figure out what material should we use for the additional board. I have copper tape which has resistance of 0,6 ohms and LVDS cables with resistance of 0,8 ohms. My board has resistance of 0,7 ohms (at least for the parts we need to mod) and 0,6 for the ground, so I guess that's how it is for the other boards as well.

If you want to see how QUAD_GTLREF looks like, here it is:

View attachment 95269 View attachment 95270

The only board pictures with descent quality are the ones from 7738G and M6400. 7738G's one seems to have the parts depopped, but this board has been used in various models, and I guess this is a Dual Core one, not exactly for 7738G. Location - underneath the CPU socket lock (7738G), and underneath the CPU arrow (missing pin) at both ends of the socket (M6400). I have tried to find a M4400 one, but those I found have its backside covered with black tape.
Click to expand...

triturbo said: ↑

This is the extra board that we'll need.

View attachment 95365

That's not the final design, but to give you (and me as well) an idea how it should look like. Still anyone interested left
Click to expand...

Click to expand...

cutthroat_jake · Apr 23, 2013

You still da man Ricki!

:thumbsup:

CJ

RickiBerlin · Apr 23, 2013

cutthroat_jake said: ↑

You still da man Ricki! :thumbsup:
Click to expand...

Several HDX give a feeling of serenity. What can happen because one already.

Info @ triturbo and others

At the end of the posts " #6850" and " #6851" I added download links.

(Power supply label in full resolution / motherboard pictures / info to C2Q) <--- So nothing really important

Dominick_7 · Apr 23, 2013

Awesome news Ricki! This is exciting!

RickiBerlin · Apr 23, 2013

Dominick_7 said: ↑

Awesome news Ricki! This is exciting!
Click to expand...

When news, then by user "triturbo". And my thanks go to him. He has no "HDX" and does still work for us. Until now, however, is all theory.

Rumors say will soon be another known user enters the "C2Q HDX research". I know he mastered the English language from an early age.
I wonder if I should mention his name, so he gets a little pressure. But I do not call "numbers" which are separated by a dot. :hi2:

I believe in success. But it's also a little embarrassing. There are people who have the knowledge and intelligence.
These have dealt with it before the year 2007/2008 and created this motherboard. And this is not a high-tech, this is a consumer device. Now we have 2013.
How would you laugh at us.

Yet we are the stupid ones with "two cores", in the future we can be twice as stupid with "four cores". Who laughs last is the most stupid, so what!

Info: In the article "#6851" small addition in the "EDIT area"

2.0 · Apr 23, 2013

.......................:hi2:

triturbo · Apr 24, 2013

Today I'll try to update the part list with more user-friendly component designation.

About the phases, it seems that they "split" the load, means, only one is working at a time. With only 2 phases (5920G) the load on each would be 50%, where with 3 (Dragon) it's 33,3%. At least they have some kind of cooling (the CPU heatsink covers them). The 3rd phase definitely improves overall stability and probably the overclockability. Whatever, as soon as I sell some of my spare parts, I'll jump on the SS PM965Quad board

I've attached a file that might be useful. The last couple of pages have components list, which would help us to find a source for the ones we need. The other way is to get a quad-enabled MoBo

View attachment Components.pdf

MobileArtist · Apr 24, 2013

triturbo said: ↑

...The other way is to get a quad-enabled MoBo
Click to expand...

A Quad Mobo with a 680M GPU, while you're at it!

Dominick_7 · Apr 24, 2013

RickiBerlin said: ↑

When news, then by user "triturbo". And my thanks go to him. He has no "HDX" and does still work for us. Until now, however, is all theory.

Rumors say will soon be another known user enters the "C2Q HDX research". I know he mastered the English language from an early age.
I wonder if I should mention his name, so he gets a little pressure. But I do not call "numbers" which are separated by a dot. :hi2:

I believe in success. But it's also a little embarrassing. There are people who have the knowledge and intelligence.
These have dealt with it before the year 2007/2008 and created this motherboard. And this is not a high-tech, this is a consumer device. Now we have 2013.
How would you laugh at us.

Yet we are the stupid ones with "two cores", in the future we can be twice as stupid with "four cores". Who laughs last is the most stupid, so what!

Info: In the article "#6851" small addition in the "EDIT area"
Click to expand...

2.0™;9173992 said:

.......................:hi2:
Click to expand...

triturbo said: ↑

Today I'll try to update the part list with more user-friendly component designation.

About the phases, it seems that they "split" the load, means, only one is working at a time. With only 2 phases (5920G) the load on each would be 50%, where with 3 (Dragon) it's 33,3%. At least they have some kind of cooling (the CPU heatsink covers them). The 3rd phase definitely improves overall stability and probably the overclockability. Whatever, as soon as I sell some of my spare parts, I'll jump on the SS PM965Quad board

I've attached a file that might be useful. The last couple of pages have components list, which would help us to find a source for the ones we need. The other way is to get a quad-enabled MoBo

View attachment 95182
Click to expand...

You guys are beasts! If you can get this done you will make the community incredibly happy. I honestly can't see myself leaving the HDX. It's too awesome. Would love to be able to get it gutted to have updated specs, a quad, backlit keyboard, updated GPU etc. To pave the way that HP doesn't seem interested in traveling. Thanks so much and big thanks also to you triturbo who doesn't even own one and is contributing to this end! So with the schematics and I guess some new info you guys really believe this is doable now? Will we finally be able to refresh our Dragons?

Dominick_7 · Apr 24, 2013

That would be incredible. The Sagers/Clevos are so expensive and kinda ugly with smaller screens. The HP Zs are cool but not portable or semi portable really. Gscreens are ok, but hate the middle bezel, the specs are ok, and the design is not even close to touching the HDX. Using the HDXs design is the only way I see being able to work on a big (adjustable) screen and also be able to carry it around as a semi portable device. Wish I had the money, then I'd produce what I believe to be my ideal device, but the HDX is the best thing minus updated specs I've seen even to the current date.

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HP HDX 9000 DRAGON Owners Lounge, Part 2

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