How to boot to BIOS when Function Buttons are not Showing?

Discussion in 'Samsung' started by KcKepz, Jun 26, 2014.

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  1. KcKepz

    KcKepz Notebook Enthusiast

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    I have a Samsung Series 5 Ultra 13.3inch (2013 model) where an update from Windows 8 to Windows 8.1 has now put my computer into a boot loop.

    I've created a boot USB stick with Windows 8 installation on it, but I have tried every key to try and boot into BIOS so that I can change the boot priority to USB or External Optical drive. I've tried the F2 function key as mentioned by many online and the Samsung manual and the F4 function key for Windows recovery but none of works. I've also tried the F10 key to change the boot order during boot up but that doesn't work either.

    I've seen in a couple of videos that others have shown where their F2 and F10 options show onscreen on the bottom right underneath the Samsung boot logo.

    I'm guessing it's obviously booting up in Fastboot which I'll disable that as soon as I get into the BIOS to change it.

    Can anyone help please. Any help is appreciated as I'm desperate to get my Ultrabook up and running as I need it to do training.

    Thank you!
     
  2. Dannemand

    Dannemand Decidedly Moderate Super Moderator

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    Hi KcKepz, welcome to NBR.

    First make sure you're trying to enter BIOS from a cold start (ie from power off). You can break the boot loop by holding the power button for 5 seconds (or so) to force the computer off. Then start tapping F2 immediately after you power on, and keep tapping it repeatedly about 2-3 times per second. The same is true for F4 to boot Samsung Recovery Solution. Both of them should work, even with Fast Boot/Fast BIOS enabled.

    If you still cannot get F2 or F4 to work, try the procedure described by John in this post to reset your CMOS and BIOS tables. After that, try F2 or F4 again.

    Another option is to try F8 to get to Windows Advanced Startup options. Again, the best way is to start cold (from power off) then tap F8 repeatedly, starting as soon as anything shows on the screen after power on.

    Once you (hopefully) are able to enter BIOS, you need to disable Fast Boot/Fast BIOS (as you say) as well as SecureBoot if you want to boot a Windows installation DVD or USB. If you install from USB, you also need to make sure the flash drive from which you install is formatted as FAT32, NOT as NTFS. Microsoft's ISO/USB creation tool does NOT work. Use Rufus or create it manually. This post in our Windows forum has guidance.

    Edit: I deleted your post in the other thread, where you asked this question again after I had responded here. Please don't cross post, it violates NBR forum rules.
     
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  3. KcKepz

    KcKepz Notebook Enthusiast

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    Thank you Dannemand for your reply.

    I'm aware of how the BIOS function keys work and when to press it. I've tried F2 which is to enter BIOS for Samsung PC's. I've tried F4 which is to go into Windows Recovery mode (F8 no longer exists in Windows 8) and F10/ESC (from what I've scoured through the internet) is to change the Boot options during boot up (before Windows boot up screen).

    Thank you for John's suggestion to reset the battery, but didn't work for me by poking the battery pin hole. Good suggestion as I've learnt something new with that pin hole.

    I've created my USB boot up with a tool I use to install my Linux distros on USB. I then took it over to my desktop to test that boot up to my USB stick works and it does.

    I only posted on the other thread because it was active. If I had posted a link to my thread I created, would that have violated NBR forum rules? I apologise.

    Now that I've replied to your post, I've done some heavy reading into my problem and what the PC is doing. It's been ages since I've had to rebuild a PC and the new Ultrabooks AND Windows 8 do something new that I'm not aware of.

    From what I've read, Windows 8 now controls BIOS with UEFI Secure Boot which secures BIOS and directs managing through Windows 8. That's new to me.... so to mange and make changes to give control back to BIOS, I have to make the change in Windows 8. Here's my problem though.... Windows 8 is in a boot loop which displays an error message at the start of Windows 8 boot up and I can't get into Windows 8 at all to change it from UEFI to BIOS.
    My reading is from this link: How to Boot and Install Linux on a UEFI PC With Secure Boot

    So because of Secure Boot, I can't get into BIOS and probably never will unless someone can tell me how to override Secure Boot.

    My Samsung start up screen looks like this in this video but does not have the F2 and F4 function options at the bottom right of screen like this guy's pc in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peEJwjJ_Uf8

    I'm really bummed at the moment as this PC is my main driver.

    A thought though, which I'm thinking would probably screw it up even more though.... if I took my slim HDD out and formatted it, will that help in some way?
     
  4. Dannemand

    Dannemand Decidedly Moderate Super Moderator

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    That's good that you know how to press F2 and F4. Many users here have trouble getting the timing right, particularly with Fast Startup enabled in Win8.x (which makes for a very brief window to get the timing right). Others just keep the key pressed down during boot, which will not work.

    Win8 does indeed have an Advanced Startup Options screen with several repair options (and not to be confused with Samsung Recovery Solution which is accessed through F4). Through it you can get to UEFI Firmware Settings or you can try to Refresh your current Windows installation.

    The problem is getting to Advanced Startup Options, since some brilliant design strategist at Microsoft decided to only make it easily accessible when you already have a working Windows installation (Charms-Settings-Change PC Settings-General in Win8, Charms-Settings-Change PC Settings-Update and Recovery-Recovery in Win8.1).

    The key combination to cold boot into Win8 Advanced Startup Options is Ctrl-F8, although a few members have reported Shift-F8 as working. (Sorry I said F8 earlier, that's only for earlier Windows versions, as you pointed out.) But the window is so narrow it can be almost impossible to hit the right timing, particularly with Fast Boot/Fast BIOS enabled. A few members used it after failed Win8.1 updates (see this and this).

    If you have a boot loop, you can also try holding Shift down while it reboots (start pressing it BEFORE the reboot starts). Holding down Shift when selecting Restart is another way to reach Advanced Startup Options from a running Win8, so if yours gets far enough before it reboots, maybe that will work.

    If none of those work, and if the CMOS reset didn't work either (which is surprising) I agree that taking out the HDD may be an option. But DON'T format it, except as last resort. Just try if you can get to BIOS settings (F2) without the HDD installed.

    If you (hopefully) can get into BIOS, reset BIOS settings to default, then disable Fast BIOS/Fast Boot and SecureBoot, but keep OS Mode Selection=UEFI OS (NOT UEFI & CSM OS). After that, you should be able to boot your Windows install media (by pressing F10 or Esc) ASSUMING the install media is FAT32.

    And yes, clean install on UEFI computers (any Win8.x computer, not just Samsung) is quite different from good old Legacy BIOS/CSM machines. The majority of installation issues posted here are caused by that. You can read more about in the posts here and here (including links to must-read Microsoft articles). Since UEFI can only boot FAT32 (not NTFS) it also affects how you create your USB install media, as described in my last post.
     
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  5. KcKepz

    KcKepz Notebook Enthusiast

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    Thanks again Dannemand.

    I've tried EVERYTHING with the F'ing buttons (lol). DAMN YOU F2, F4, F8 and F10 LOL.

    OK, I've tried;

    :( I've tried the key combinations, Ctrl+F8 AND Shift+F8 and did nothing for me.

    :( Holding the SHIFT button I was not able to do because my Windows loop at the start of Windows Boot up (I only see the Windows icon at the start for no more than 5 seconds and then I get the new blue screen of death), I don't get far at all.

    :( I'll try boot up without the hdd soon as I can try everything without having to start pulling hardware out

    I've formatted a USB as you've suggested in FAT32 and then try as soon as I can find a way to boot to USB. Man this sucks!
     
  6. KcKepz

    KcKepz Notebook Enthusiast

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    UPDATE:

    I took the hdd out and the PC goes through it's priority boot and checks each media. It boots to USB obviously because there's no hdd and so I managed to run the UEFI option in the Windows Advance Repair from my USB and then was able to disable UEFI and Secure Boot. I then changed the Boot order to boot from USB first and then saved settings and connected my hdd but the damn laptop keeps booting from hdd. I go back to BIOS via the UEFI Config via my USB and find the boot order has gone back to default. However, something I noticed is that USB CD/DVD Media was before hdd and so I go looking through the house for my external CD/DVD reader and burnt a copy of Windows 8.1 to disc and then boot the pc with the USB Disc reader connected to it and with DVD installation disc in there and the PC still boots up to hdd after a failed read from the USB DVD Drive. This is really pee'ing me off...

    Later tonight, I'm going to format the hdd but wanted to ask someone this as I can't remember what happens. What does the PC do when hdd is blank but it's the first in the boot order? Does it come back saying no OS installed on hdd and then fail boot or will it try the next media device? (in this case, I'm hoping that it recognises that hdd is blank and then moves down the boot order which will then reach the USB and then FIIIIINALLY boot from USB so that I may reinstall Windows 8.1)
     
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  7. Dannemand

    Dannemand Decidedly Moderate Super Moderator

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    Just got up, this'll be a fast one: You should not have disabled UEFI (only SecureBoot). Your Windows installation is UEFI and your disk is GPT, you need OS Mode Selection=UEFI for it to boot.

    But great that you managed to get into BIOS.

    I think you should just use F4 (which hopefully works now) and restore to factory.

    If you begin a new installation from USB, you will run into another issue that we haven't discussed yet with your ExpressCache drive confusing things. Installing from DVD eliminates that issue.
     
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  8. KcKepz

    KcKepz Notebook Enthusiast

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    While you've only gotten up, I'm about to go to sleep lol. Australia time, sorry but thank you for taking the time out to reply.

    Let me change those settings again and then take a few screenshots for you and you tell me if what you see is right. Let me do what I did to get into BIOS and make those changes again.
     
  9. Dannemand

    Dannemand Decidedly Moderate Super Moderator

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    I added some to my post, but you posted before (I'm typing on phone, slow).
     
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  10. KcKepz

    KcKepz Notebook Enthusiast

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    Just read the rest of your post. I'm guessing you're using an iPhone lol :p
    With SWYPE, I can type faster than I touch type ;)

    Anyways... this is what I've got so far in my BIOS config, but my boot order won't stay after I reboot for some reason. I know it's not normal but I'm going to ask the stupid question anyways... is that normal?

    IMG_20140627_223210.jpg

    IMG_20140627_223226.jpg

    IMG_20140627_223242.jpg

    IMG_20140627_223447.jpg
     
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