How Dell cripple performance explained by Notebookcheck.net

Discussion in 'Hardware Components and Aftermarket Upgrades' started by Papusan, Sep 14, 2017.

  1. Mobius 1

    Mobius 1 what is quality control?

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    I mean if you want to sustain full boost then you would need that much TDP.

    The power consumption of intel CPUs can't really go lower now until there's a node update or an architecture update.
     
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  2. tijo

    tijo Sacred Blame Super Moderator

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    It wouldn't surprise me at all. They'll go to their design team and ask them to design for the TDP advertised by Intel and design around that one spec.

    Now, if Intel would provide a typical clock vs heat dissipated curve for a set operating time, that would be a much better design starting point instead of two or three data points. Dell could still make the choice to design for 15 W and consciously choose to have something that can only turbo for short bursts, but at least their engineers/designers would know exactly what they are aiming for.

    If you were to ask me to design a cooling for a 15W TDP system with little to no other information, I would design for 15W, slap an oversize factor on top of it (Dell probably has one their engineers/designers use) to allow for some leeway and call it a day.

    If I knew roughly how the CPU behaved however, let's say that 28W value is what you need for constant maximum clocks, then if asked to design a high performance system, it would be easy to aim for 28 W of cooling performance (+ over-sizing). You could even design for the "almighty skin temp" constraint that Mr.Fox mentioned previously and still have a laptop that cools itself nicely and performs at peak performance.

    It would also be very likely that Dell would ask for a 15W design regardless of the amount of information they have, but I'd be willing to bet that better data on the heat/performance of the CPU would go a long way to get laptop manufacturers to design systems that operate at full turbo. Something tells me they are completely unwilling to invest the time, money and personnel to do their own testing on how the CPUs behave in terms of thermals and performance except for a few expensive more niche systems they can sell at a major premium as in Dell Precisions mostly. Seems like they were willing to do with Alienwares before, but scrapped that altogether. From what I've seen in the Precision forums, that line seems to still be doing ok in that regard.
     
  3. Silvr6

    Silvr6 Notebook Evangelist

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    Obviously some people have an agenda to point out throttling and try to look at everything in a negative light. If you look at my separate thread which is be no means an exhaustive list of benchmarks, the i7 8550u for all intents and purposes is FASTER than the i7 3840QM in my Precision M4700. When I stated my cpu didn't throttle (Inspiron 13 7000) I meant it did not throttle in a negative way. It is able to pull 44w of power for a few seconds and then slowly starts dropping its clock speed to comply with TDP restrictions. The XPS 13 from notebookcheck benches a little bit higher and had the same throttling behavior because its PL2 Power limit is set at 51W (vs the 44W of mine). My cpu finally settles in a 2.5-2.6ghz when loaded on all cores and it does so continuously while using about 17W (CPU power) I think dell may have set the TDP a bit higher than factory on this model(there is a TDP up of 2.0ghz at 25W according to intel). Sure it throttles in furmark and that is actually fine in my books because i haven't used any programs that stress any of the computers i've owned to that point aka its not a real world situation for 95% of notebook users. Being disappointed about not having a heatsink design for 44w or say 28w so a cpu doesn't throttle doesn't make a lot of sense in an ultrabook, my inspiron is thin and light and in now way has a cooling system designed for 28w sustained use and I really don't need one as its faster by a large margin than the model is replaces.

    You would have be insane to think that a 15w quadcore isn't going to throttle but it's not throttling in a way that negatively affects performance. Once again many places have shown this cpu nearly as fast or faster than the 45W quadcore cpu's. I can only speak to the inspiron 7000 13 I have but its better than my M4700 in every way except for GPU performance which is to be expected. So looking at it from a pure CPU perspective there is ZERO negatives at all.

    Here are my benchmarks

    http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...ing-behavior-on-dell-inspiron-13-7000.809595/

    A review of a notebook similar to mine @ Techspot

    https://www.techspot.com/review/1500-intel-8th-gen-core-quad-core-ultrabooks/

    What is interesting is the conclusion
    Across every workload, on average we saw the i7-8850U outperform the i7-7500U by 49 percent. That’s huge.

    Once again there is "throttling" but it should be taken out of context to mean its negative as its been shown over and over again its performance is so far above what anyone thought.

    Ok rant done
     
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  4. Vasudev

    Vasudev Notebook Virtuoso

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    That means the 8 th gen BGA HQ or HK can do much better than ULV with quad cores.
    Well that's good performance. Just keep an eye on performance after each BIOS update and keep older BIOS on your disk in case you observe any issues.
     
  5. Silvr6

    Silvr6 Notebook Evangelist

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    Based on the great performance in the 15W design, imagine if dell put this CPU in the XPS 15 which is designed for a higher TDP better battery life and lower temps.
     
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  6. Vasudev

    Vasudev Notebook Virtuoso

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    At the price point and form factor they might do it. But they are more expensive than hq chips of earlier generation.
     
  7. tilleroftheearth

    tilleroftheearth Wisdom listens quietly...

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    What? Not comparing properly they're not? (New to new).

    Even if they're the same price; inflation makes the new chips effectively cheaper.

     
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  8. Vasudev

    Vasudev Notebook Virtuoso

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    Here at my place it will be damn expensive
     
  9. tilleroftheearth

    tilleroftheearth Wisdom listens quietly...

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    Our personal budget vs. the cost of something desirable doesn't make something more (or less) expensive.

    Everything is expensive everywhere; it is late into 2017...

     
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  10. Papusan

    Papusan BGA Filthy = That sucks!! STAHP! Dont buy FILTH...

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    Vasudev likes this.
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