GT72/GT72S and GT80/GT80S Owners GPU Upgrade Discussion

Discussion in 'MSI' started by hmscott, Aug 22, 2016.

  1. hacktrix2006

    hacktrix2006 Hold My Vodka, I going to kill my GPU

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    Well it would seem that the GT72-6 Series is having luck. Nvidia GTX1060 also confirmed working however Driver inf mod is need to install the drivers.

    Bloetschkopf over at Techinferno has installed it in both the GT72 Skylake and the GT70.

    Here is his benchmarks
    So that really make the question to MSI misleading description of why we need this so say Trade-Up (Down) program. So thats now the GTX 1060 and GTX 1070 Confirmed working and by looks of it a EC and VBIOS update would solve the issues current to the pascal upgrades on our GT series notebook.

    By the looks of the benchmarks GTX970m to GTX1060 is 2x the performance in benchmark scores.
     
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  2. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    A full 1060 MXM is supposed to draw 100w, so that power use would match that of a laptop with a 980m MXM drawing 100w, while a 970m MXM is 81w so 100w might be too much load as an upgrade.

    A full 1070 MXM at 150w and full 1080 MXM at 180w wouldn't be a good fit in a MXM position designed for 100w/81w.

    MXM cards vary in power use depending on the vendor and application - even though they are all supposed to be at the same power usage, so there could be variances down/up.

    It would take a good mix of tests, with comparisons against original build full power 1060 / 1070 / 1080 new laptops, before we would know whether the MXM only upgrades are working.

    The brettsidford 1070 thread didn't provide any temps, power draw, or benchmark results with comparisons after install info, so we don't know if it's running at full performance:

    "...Not done much benchmarking if you want me to do something specific let me know and I'll give it a go."

    He hasn't posted more results since, maybe after holiday he will return with some test run results with temperatures and power usage info.

    Maybe someone with a new MSI 1070 laptop can go there and post some typical results, Heaven with normal settings, Fire Strike base and Ultra, and some other GPU based benchmark that full loads the GPU so we can see temperature and power monitoring results too.

    And, then ask brettsidford to run the same tests at the same settings, and provide the test results with accompanying temperature and power draw monitoring results.

    Another user, ferz93, over on the MSI forums in that thread has posted he also has put in a 1070, hopefully he will post some test results too:

    « Reply #14 on: Yesterday at 09:18:00 »
    Hello guys!
    I also have 1070 installed on my GT72 6QD, it works fine but doesn’t support GSync, and with 1070 I can’t overclock my monitor, now it's only 70Hz, with 970m it was 103Hz, original frequency is 75hz.
    « Last Edit: Yesterday at 16:59:17 by ferz93 »

    We really need someone to do the proper tests to see if these upgrades give full performance, and the original cooling under full performance can deliver adequate cooling.

    MSI told us that our old laptops would need upgraded Power and Cooling, that would still be true if these upgrades show they don't have enough power for full performance or enough cooling at full performance.

    I'll send these new developments over to MSI USA Trade-in Team and cite the MSI Reps here as well and see what they say :)

    @MSI Myco @MSI Natalie @MSIGeno @snallygaster

    Merry Xmas everyone MSI, IDK if this is a present or a lump of coal, but please read this response and those posts leading up to it (and after) over the last few pages.

    Check out the links you find to the reports of owners of GT laptops upgrading on their own using an MSI 1070 / 1060 MXM card and getting them to work. - What's up with that?? Thanks! - Scott

    Update: Sent this post to MSI Trade-in Team asking what they think of this.
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2016
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  3. hacktrix2006

    hacktrix2006 Hold My Vodka, I going to kill my GPU

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    @hmscott Also the Vbios on the GTX1060 GTX1070 was pre-Gsync enablement which MSI did via use of a Bios update and Vbios update at least on the GT72VR-6RE and GT72VR-6RD so more then likely if the guy that placed a GTX1070 in his GT72-6QD updated the VBIOS Gsync should work again.

    So it would seem its more a Lump of coal for MSI right now.
     
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  4. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    If the Pascal MXM upgrades in the old chassis show comparable performance results with newly designed and purpose built upgraded chassis, showing full power and cooling capability, it would prove those upgrades could have been offered without additional hardware upgrades.

    We don't know about the cost of those MXM upgrades, since they weren't offered by MSI, and we can only guess the associated cost of installing / upgrading.

    MSI mentioned along the way after announcing GPU upgrades that we wouldn't be able to do them ourselves, and that we would be required to send in our laptops to perform the GPU upgrades. So we need to count both parts and labor costs into the total cost.

    MSI also didn't say if the upgrade cost would including returning our old MXM GPU's or if they would be kept as part of the upgrade process.

    It's sad that MSI didn't prepare better for this whole GPU upgrade, explain the upgrade process reasoning better - more fully - and didn't do a better job of providing all this early - instead of telling us to buy new laptops.

    If nothing else, MSI has kept at it, refining the process along the way, but it's not a method that leads to 100% happy satisfied customers.

    I'd still like MXM upgrades over the whole laptop swap myself, one of the reasons I've waited.

    I do believe and did hope that MSI would provide kits to do an upgrade, upgraded internal hardware, external power, cooling components, and make it a DIY offering.

    But, you work with what you have at the time, or you end up arguing the whole time instead of making positive progress toward a workable result.

    The Trade-in upgrade path is still good for many - I can understand wanting upgraded laptop hardware to go with the new generation MXM GPU's, and as time goes by that becomes more and more the case - Kaby Lake, Cannon Lake, Coffee Lake, motherboard chipset and CPU upgrades with associated new features and hopefully improved performance, etc.

    If MSI can be persuaded to offer both upgrade paths, that would be awesome :)

    MSI has to make a profit on both upgrade paths - they are in business to stay in business so I don't believe in asking MSI to do either path without profit or for free.

    I don't think anyone believed the MXM GPU upgrades were going to be cheap, especially for us GT80 owners needing 2 GPU's upgraded.

    It's pretty commonly believed that an MXM upgrade instead of a trade-in would be cheaper, but after thinking about it, a MXM GPU upgrade with ancillary support components is going to add to the "just MXM GPU" costs - new power supplies / duplexer, new cooling components, and the labor to swap all these parts. Maybe more of a problem with the GT80 upgrades vs the GT72 upgrades.

    Not to mention the support nightmare of getting all those DIY upgraded laptops in for service - after the inexperienced owner muffs a step or two during the upgrade - maybe even nixing a GPU. Very expensive support wise, which would increase costs MSI would need to charge to cover expense and make a profit.

    Like I said, I wish MSI had thought this through better from the start, and had a more up front full discussion about the benefits and costs of both upgrade paths, and why MSI went the way they did go with the full laptop trade-in's.

    These constructive hacks to apply Pascal GPU's in our vintage hardware are awesome, even promising, but I need more concrete results data before I think they are fully functional without additional hardware upgrades, and are a viable upgrade path as MXM only upgrades.

    Happy Holidays to Everyone :)
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2016
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  5. hacktrix2006

    hacktrix2006 Hold My Vodka, I going to kill my GPU

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    @hmscott feel the same way.

    The GTX800-GTX900 MXM Upgrade Kit was sold under the premise it needed to go to MSI Service Centre to be upgraded, however if the End user was sure that he/she was able to DIY then it was a simple case of agreeing to If you broke something during the upgrade it wasn't covered on warranty.

    Which many would be happy with so the cost in time and money wouldn't be that great to be honest as bare in-mind it was only available in select countries where law permitted it.

    Also the cost would be slightly cheaper as the P&P would be less for DIY'ers.
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2016
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  6. MiSJAH

    MiSJAH Notebook Deity

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    Not quite. MSI said that users could make the upgrade by themselves and produced a kit they would ship:

    [​IMG]

    This kit is still available to purchase for from here and here.

    SKU's for retail MXM upgrade kits for 970M and 980M: 957-178111E-001 and 957-178111E-002.

    Merry Christmas one and all. :) :) :)
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2016
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  7. hacktrix2006

    hacktrix2006 Hold My Vodka, I going to kill my GPU

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    @MiSJAH Thats all the new upgrade kit should be as the GT72VR has the same fans. So it should just be the following.

    MXM Card (GTX1060 or GTX1070 due to the MXM slot giving out a max of 125w capped with EC Firmware)
    Heatsink (GT72VR-6RE's at least for the GT72 range)
    Driver CD
    Bios Update
    EC Firmware Update

    At least for the systems with G-Sync as we already have the EDP that the GPU requires screen wise, however its likely to end up in the modders hand as the Lumps of coal are getting a bit heavy in the Santa Bag for MSI right now.

    Even the fans used in the GT72VR are the same as the GT72 same part number.

    If MSI gave both paths as an option then the Pro DIY'ers could go the MXM route and the rest could of gone via the Service Centres or Trade up(Down).

    Which i did mention to MSI in my e-mails. Even the new GT73 GT83 with skylake are now obsolete due to kaby lake refreshes in 2017.

    However MSI went the route they took very much doubt an Offical MXM Card Upgrade path will be made available even with the current news of success.
     
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  8. iTzZent

    iTzZent Notebook Consultant

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    Here is the Heatsink Mod from the GT72 6QE Heatsink to use GTX1060 (old MXM Design) and GTX1070 (new MXM Design)
     

    Attached Files:

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  9. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    FYI - the new MSI 16L13 15.6" LGA Skylake / Kabylake GTX 1080 model shipping as Eurocom F5 isn't backwards compatible MXM-wise with the previous Eurocom F5 1060 / 1070 / Maxwell models - so no GTX 1080 GPU upgrade will be available.

    http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...cussions-lounge.797128/page-182#post-10419546

    "...SO - I am telling you all this, so if you purchased in hopes of upgrading to the 1080 coming out - you will need the new motherboard too, with PSU, heatsinks etc.."

    Lots more good detailed info for current and prospective Eurocom F5 (MSI 16L13) owners from @woodzstack in that post and others.

    "TL/DR
    120HZ in 1 week+.
    1080/7700K refresh in 1 week+ (new motherboard, not backwards compatible with previous MXM)
    Kaby lake support ready now, m.2 not fully pci-e x4 on new bios. 2 weeks will be perfected. Not yet perfect, and not backwards compatible.
    Bad flash - not covered by warranty.
    F5 price probably going up."
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2016
  10. woodzstack

    woodzstack Alezka Computers , Official Clevo reseller.

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    wow, good job. Look at that work, just need to polish it now to keep the microair gaps to a minimum. (affects cooling alot...)
     
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