Eurocom Tornado F5/Eurocom Tornado F7 with 6-core Coffee lake cpus?

Discussion in 'MSI' started by sicily428, Apr 26, 2017.

  1. Delgada89

    Delgada89 Notebook Consultant

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    We should have more info on what's coming once they lift the NDAs on the 5th. It's the 5th right?
     
  2. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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  3. omega939

    omega939 Notebook Evangelist

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    When will be the availability of the Z390 chipset for F7 and when will this laptop comes out?
     
  4. sicily428

    sicily428 Donuts!! :)

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    Asus Interview: Andrew Wu (ROG Motherboard PM)
    http://www.bit-tech.net/features/tech/motherboards/asus-interview-andrew-wu-rog-motherboard-pm/1/

    "bit-tech: Can you go into more technical detail about why the new CPUs are not backwards-compatible with Z270 motherboards?

    Andrew: Actually, it depends on Intel’s decision.

    bit-tech: So it’s not a physical limitation? Intel said it was to do with power delivery.

    Andrew: Not really. It [the power delivery] makes a little bit of difference, but not much.

    bit-tech: So what are they referring to – the 20 or so unused pins from before?

    Andrew: Yes.

    bit-tech: So if you wanted and Intel let you, you could make Z270 compatible?

    Andrew: Yes, but you also require an upgrade from the ME [Management Engine] and a BIOS update. Intel somehow has locked the compatibility.

    bit-tech: The 20 previously unused pins that you mentioned, what are they now used for?

    Andrew: Many of them are used for power control. It's possible that these are in preparation for the high-core count processors.

    bit-tech: Intel has also said that overclocking has been improved with ‘enhanced package power delivery’. Do you know what that refers to? Is that also the 20 pins or something else?

    Andrew: Because this is a refresh platform, Intel has somehow made it even more mature, so it will be even more stable than the previous generation. From what I can see, this refresh doesn’t mean a bad thing for users. Usually, the kind of customers that already have a Z270 board will probably not upgrade for this generation. For the majority of Z370 users, maybe they have been using their PC for three or five years, so these are still good products for them to upgrade to.

    bit-tech: So you’re not looking to target Z270 customers, you’re looking at older customers?

    Andrew: We’re targeting anyone that wants or needs to buy a new system. It’s logical that many people on Z270 don’t need to upgrade. But there are still some people that would like to try these six-core processors, and they will still upgrade their systems. For users that have older systems, Coffee Lake offers great performance. You’ve got better power efficiency, higher clock speeds, the option of more cores, and faster storage.
    "
     
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  5. hfm

    hfm Notebook Virtuoso

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    Lets just agree that no one really upgrades their laptops, they just buy new ones. Majority speaking anyway.

    I probably won't upgrade this I'll just buy another one in 3 years..
     
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  6. Kevin@GenTechPC

    Kevin@GenTechPC Company Representative

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    Most of customers usually perform upgrades on memory and SSD, other things too but those are rare.
     
  7. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    Therein lay the fallacy of LGA upgradeability.

    Just because you can remove the CPU and replace it with a new one, doesn't guarantee Intel's product upgrade cycle will offer you a new and better CPU to fit in the same motherboard socket in the future.

    Intel has killed the relevance of LGA upgrades.

    Intel has locked out vendor enhancements with the Intel Management Engine (Spyware) that controls the motherboard vendors ability to offer you innovative deviations from Intel's desires.

    The work around to disable Intel's Management Engine:

    Now you, too, can disable Intel ME 'backdoor' thanks to the NSA
    Researchers discovered an undocumented configuration setting that can used to disable the Intel ME master controller that has been likened to a backdoor.
    (Spyware and Control of your PC outside of your control).
    https://www.csoonline.com/article/3...able-intel-me-backdoor-thanks-to-the-nsa.html

    "A team of researchers from Positive Technologies discovered an undocumented configuration setting, designed for use by government agencies, to disable Intel Management Engine 11. Now you too can partake in this government privilege to inactivate Intel’s proprietary CPU master controller."

    But, vendors won't jump that Shark, as their Billion $ companies would be at risk.

    Hopefully AMD's socketed CPU's in the form AM4, TR4, and ? for future growth will have the promised 4 years of life CPU upgrades, with forward and backwards compatibility.
     
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  8. Kevin@GenTechPC

    Kevin@GenTechPC Company Representative

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    You can't disable Intel ME but you can disable Intel AMT (part of ME) on applicable systems. Intel ME is crucial to the operation of system so if it's disabled then the system will not function.
     
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  9. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    When the NSA Disable Bit is flipped, the ME is not active after the boot (where the ME is "needed" to functionally boot), and when the ME is disabled and not active to answer to network requests or other pre-authorized "activity" unbeknownst to the motherboard owner, you've removed one of the (many?) backdoors into your system.

    "The researchers discovered an undocumented field called “reserve-hap” and that HAP could be set to “1” for true. Apparently, the NSA wanted to ensure the agency could close off any possible security risk by disabling Intel ME. The researchers wrote, “We believe that this mechanism is designed to meet a typical requirement of government agencies, which want to reduce the possibility of side-channel leaks.”"
    "When told about the research, Intel told Positive Technologies:

    In response to requests from customers with specialized requirements, we sometimes explore the modification or disabling of certain features. In this case, the modifications were made at the request of equipment manufacturers in support of their customer’s evaluation of the U.S. government’s “High Assurance Platform” program. These modifications underwent a limited validation cycle and are not an officially supported configuration."

    "If you want to disable Intel ME, you should first read the in-depth technical explanation about the researchers finding “an undocumented PCH strap that can be used to switch on a special mode disabling the main Intel ME functionality at an early stage.” Positive Technologies also made its Intel ME 11.x firmware image unpacker utility available on GitHub. Use at your own risk; the methods to disable Intel ME were described as “risky and may damage or destroy your computer.”
    Windows 10 is still there doing it's thing, no matter how well you think you've stomped on it's privacy invasions.

    If there is a NSA bit to disable Windows 10 invasions, it's not widely known.

    Likely as not, it's a different release of the OS, just like the Chinese variant.

    Again, LGA is dead, there are no CPU upgrades generation to generation, and it appears there are no (timely?) MXM upgrades, there is only ease of replacement.

    Ease of replacement is certainly a good thing unto itself :)
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2017
  10. Kevin@GenTechPC

    Kevin@GenTechPC Company Representative

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    No, you can't disable ME completely. It serves as cerebellum in the brain. Also, AMD has the same thing too.
    Code:
    The disappointing fact is that on modern computers, it is impossible to completely disable ME. This is primarily due to the fact that this technology is responsible for initialization, power management, and launch of the main processor. Another complication lies in the fact that some data is hard-coded inside the PCH chip functioning as the southbridge on modern motherboards. The main method used by enthusiasts trying to disable ME is to remove everything "redundant" from the image while maintaining the computer's operability. But this is not so easy, because if built-in PCH code does not find ME modules in the flash memory or detects that they are damaged, the system will not start.
    Regarding LGA upgradeability, this still exists on desktop systems but even so there aren't many people that perform CPU upgrades after the initial purchase.
     
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