Deciding between an EVOC P775TM-R and P870TM-R

Discussion in 'Sager and Clevo' started by craum, Jan 27, 2020.

  1. craum

    craum Notebook Enthusiast

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    Hello friends,

    This is my introductory post to NotebookReview and the Clevo forum. A bit about me...

    What I do when I'm not gaming: I'm a micro/nanofabrication engineer specializing in MEMS fab & process control.
    Cheekiest mod: I over clocked my Celeron 300A CPU from 300 to 450 MHz (stable) via a "celery sandwich" design (yes I know how much this dates me).
    Most expensive mod: I bought 16MB ram for $400 (~$700 in today's $) for an IDE caching hard drive controller (again somewhat dating me) to open up the worst bottleneck on my 486 DX2-66.

    Over the years I've become less of a performance optimizer hobbyist and more interested in convenience and portability - while still maintaining performance.

    I've used the ASUS G751JY in my sig for 5 years and was happy enough with it until a trigger-pulling event occurred - the upcoming release of "Half-Life: Alyx"! I want a high end VR ready rig that will last another 5 years (w/ potential CPU/GPU/memory upgrades along the way).

    My initial intention was to buy a refurbished Alienware Area 51m from Dell with i9-9900K/RTX2080 and add my own memory/storage, but the more research I did the more I came to realize the 51m is a new chassis design and thermal management system, and it shows w/ the GPU throttling debacle.

    The following video was the final nail in the coffin, which was a bitter pill to swallow, since I had come to appreciate the design of the 51m and was looking forward to being an owner.



    Now that I'm weighing functionality over form I'm tending toward a Clevo solution for my gaming/computing needs. This means either an EVOC P775TM-R or a P870TM-R (I'm still trying to understand the whole Clevo / Sager / EVOC ecosystem - but I think the Clevo design philosophy is more upgrade/configuration flexibility than other desk top replacement platforms - esp if I'm using a value-added reseller like HIDevolution).

    So if you've read this far - thank you. Now for some questions:

    1) The only reason I can see for choosing the P870 over P775 is possibly better thermals (does that really account for being ~3 lbs heavier???). Both have access to same level of components (except SLI?), and holding those equal, the P870 seems to come in about $700 more expensive.

    Why choose the P870 over the P775? If I overclock the i9-9900KS I intend to use, will it statistically last longer in a P870 because the CPU will be cooler? Will fan noise be less, holding over-clock parameters equal?

    2) Does P870 being in end of life status have any practical ramifications if I use a VAR?

    3) What do you think might be a better choice than a VAR build of a P775/P870? I also considered the MSI GT76 Titan, but at least through HIDEvolution, there seemed to be less configuration flexibility at higher price.

    Thanks again.
     
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  2. joluke

    joluke Notebook Deity

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    P775TM1 is the latest version with support for i9 and RTX. The P870 was discontinued by Clevo so your best bet is to go with the P775TM1-G
     
  3. jc_denton

    jc_denton V̖̟en̰g̻̼̰̩͙ea̲n̪c̭e̼ ͍̘̤͓̟̤Is̙͔ ̤Mi̻̭̣͎͍ͅn̰ḙ

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    Yes, thermals will be better due to a beefier cooling solution and a vapor chamber capable of 4-500W of cooling. It will have a higher thermal ceiling in terms of performance headroom compared to the P7. The P870TMx from HID will also come with the latest Prema bios supporting 'KS' and RTX. Motherboard is limited to x8 instead of x16 PCI-e, however this does not affect performance since current gen of MXM doesn't even saturate x8 bandwidth.

    Being EOL doesn't really affect it much, it still the same lga1151/z370 chipset that the P7 uses. You might want to wait until Q2 of 2020 for the Clevo X170, since it will support the new LGA1200 socket.
     
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  4. Meaker@Sager

    Meaker@Sager Company Representative

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    If you use cad simulations and can target workloads at GPUs I believe you can get the p870 with 2x RTX 2080 but this will do nothing in regular apps.
     
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  5. craum

    craum Notebook Enthusiast

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    Thanks for the spec info/advice. Waiting for the X170 is very tempting. I look at the design and it's pretty slick (The P8 design is nice... the P7 - meh). Not to mention putting the latest CPU/GPU in it. My general rule for upgrades, however, is every two generations, one generation from the latest. So for example I have a GTX 980 now, go to RTX 2080 as the RTX 3080 is coming out. I think it's a good price/performance compromise. On the other hand, if I'm going to spend too much money already why not *way* too much money. :rolleyes:
     
  6. craum

    craum Notebook Enthusiast

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    Thanks for the feedback! Sheesh, so many models... P775TM, TM-G, DM3-G, TM1, TM-R; P870TM-R, TM-G, TM1, TM1-G, DM, ETC... Plus the Sager and Eurocom varations. I know most of these are old/outdated, but out of curiosity has anyone ever drawn up a spread sheet / family tree for all the permutations and combinations of makes/models?
     
  7. craum

    craum Notebook Enthusiast

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    I would use L-Edit, COMSOL Multiphysics and Adobe Creative Cloud for non-gaming purposes, and I bet most games couldn't take advantage... I'm afraid running two 2080's would just be for bragging rights (not that there's anything wrong with that).
     
  8. CedricFP

    CedricFP Notebook Evangelist

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    Just wanted to ask, why is this your general rule?

    Laptops don't really follow the same price/performance thing that desktop parts do brand new; perhaps they do in the second hand market?

    Are you planning on buying the laptop only once the 3000 series comes out? Because that, at the moment, is shaping up to be a fairly long wait. The X170 is almost certainly going to debut with either an RTX2080 or 2080 Super.

    And if you mean it's better value to buy a generation of GPU on the 'eve' of the next generation, well, a specced out P775 with a 2080 hasn't exactly come down in price since the 2080's release.
     
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  9. craum

    craum Notebook Enthusiast

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    No, you're right. The model works best on discrete devices, like smart phones. Especially since the price drops quite a lot when the latest year's model comes out. I didn't really appreciate that the pricing evolution (ie P775) of laptops was so slow.
     
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  10. tps3443

    tps3443 Notebook Deity

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    The P750 and P775 are pretty similar in terms of controlling heat output, and how far you can overclock these machines. The P870 is really a stationary beast of a laptop.

    You can squeeze some good performance out of them though.

    My 15.6” P750 is heavy, thick, and not too portable. I could only imagine trying to carry around a Clevo P870.

    I would say, save hundreds and buy the P775TM1-G.

    Buying a retail P870 just isn’t worth it anymore. They’re way to expensive, especially from EVOC. And especially since SLI is now dead. You practically gain nothing. The P870 is really good a keeping the CPU and GPU much cooler then the P750, or P775. But, RTX graphics cards run way colder than GTX series. So it really makes minimal difference now.

    Save some cash and go for a P775 with a 9900K, and a RTX2080 or wait until the new 2020 Clevo’s come out.

    I really do like the P870, and I wouldn’t mind having one. But, If I dropped my components in to a p870TM1 barebone the performance boost would not be worth the cost in the end. Slightly lower CPU temps maybe, and a cooler running GPU if I had the optional Vapor chamber.

    It was cheaper to buy a entirely new RTX graphics card.

    P775TM1-G all the way.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2020
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