[Conference Call] Nvidia GeForce GTX 580M 78C° Throttling [SEE POST #191 and later]

Discussion in 'Alienware 17 and M17x' started by DELLChrisM, Feb 28, 2012.

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  1. Jody

    Jody Notebook Deity

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    This did come up as a side note. I brought it up because we asked about the hdmi input problem. They are aware of the hdmi input issue and they are working on it. The fix might come in the form of a bios update. There is no fix right now but the potential fix could be a bios update. I said I really don't want to go past A08 because I don't want my ssd throttled. The answer indicated that the SATAIII problem was a chipset thing and not a BIOS thing. I never actually tried A09 myself so I could not speak intelligently on the problem. It made me think that maybe the Sata III thing is a problem intermittently all the time no matter the BIOS revision you're running. I decided to do more testing on this myself. Honestly I never benched my ssd with A09. I decided to flash and test before pressing the issue. Besides, there wasn't an engineer who deals with that on the call. We had Louis and he's a GPU guy. I can tell you he REALLY knows his business too. I could have asked him questions for two more hours.
     
  2. dekpos

    dekpos Newbie

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    I'm using my M17x with the stock vBIOS & clocks, and since the ambient temperatures in India hover around 30C, the 580m reaches 78C in every gaming session. The tragedy is that Dell only sells the 580m version in India. Also, I've had a full set of parts replaced by technicians already.

    I can't see any solution emerge here that resolves the issue for people from regions with high ambient temperatures. Are we supposed to stop gaming with our M17x's? Will Dell stop selling the M17x here, considering that almost all users will experience this issue?
     
  3. MickyD1234

    MickyD1234 Notebook Prophet

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    I can confirm this is the correct process (about a year ago). You transfer the warranty to your country of destination. The warranty can change though depending on the destination in my experience. I had to transfer some laptops to mexico and brazil to be told that 'we don't offer accidental damage coverage in latin American countries', I'll not post the highly controversial reason the guy gave when I called to complain...

    Well, firstly a big thank you to the dell guys that spoke on the call. I'll now wait for a replacement (as advised with my particular issue) and see how it goes.

    What I did take away from the call is that the R3 with a 580 is right on the ragged edge of it's design specs so we are stuck as far as any OC'ing goes (without using our own fixes) and have to accept that it can't cope with some games without a 20% drop in performance.

    I still think there was a certain amount of 'smoke and mirrors', especially when it all went quiet when the engineer was questioned about the power draw but they tried hard to show that it was not a bad design choice to offer this card.

    I do wonder if any R2 owners that have upgraded have the same issue? Does it have the same 240W power supply since the MB is a different design and can run 2 cards?

    I know that there is a serious lead time in new model design but an intake on the front (design guys, it would look awesome as a 'mouth' between the lights) instead of right next to the output where hot air ends up circulated would be a good start, as well as fold-out legs as found on some models would be nice. But a better power design is really what is needed for this card.

    Maybe part of the 580 re-badging is a 'hidden' fix for it's OTT power draw since the published specs are exactly the same. Or it could be just an attempt to distance themselves (Nvidia) from it. Anyone researching a 580, as i wish I had, would (should) probably go for the AMD right now, ignoring the fact that if you want 120hz 3D you have no choice...
     
  4. F-117 Nighthawk

    F-117 Nighthawk Notebook Enthusiast

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    Bill, I find this whole issue a bit unsettling. I get the sense that due to this trottling issue an original system with the 580m card (without any of the solutions offered by the community) is actually substantially less powerfull than a similar system but with the 6990m. Is this correct?
     
  5. Dell-Bill_B

    Dell-Bill_B Guest

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    Have you had your heat sink replaced and run benchmarks to compare with the 6990 systems yet? Not a rhetorical question.
     
  6. Mr. Fox

    Mr. Fox Undefiled BGA-Hating Elitist

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    The GTX 580M is noticeably more powerful than 6990M. Unless tessellation is disabled on the 6990M, the GTX 580M consistently gets higher benchmark scores in my experience. Enabling PPU to offset the tessellation cheat, the GTX 580M stomps the 6990M. The GTX 580M also produces a superior visual experience, with more vibrant and detailed graphics than what I have ever experienced with an AMD GPU.
     
  7. F-117 Nighthawk

    F-117 Nighthawk Notebook Enthusiast

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    Bill, I hope to receive my new system next week (after a 5 week periode wait!), so no. Under Dutch law, I have the right to return the system within a 7-day period, so it is quite important for me to get clearity on this subject quickly, since I was under the impression that I ordered the most powerfull system (GPU wise).

    Mr Fox, many thanks for your answer. But what I would like to know is whether the R3 with a 580M + its power- and 78 degrees trottles is as powerfull (or even more so) as an R3 with a 6990M?
     
  8. Dell-Bill_B

    Dell-Bill_B Guest

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    Unless the policy is different in BeNeLux, you should have 21 days to return under Dell policy. If your system throttles (hits 78C) more often than you feel it should, we need to replace your heat sink. If that does not resolve your issues, we need to process a return for customer satisfaction. If you have any trouble dealing with BeNeLux support, let me know, and I'll get assistance from internal contacts.
     
  9. YodaGoneMad

    YodaGoneMad Notebook Deity

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    I actually have done this, I had a 6990m to replace my first 580m (since the 580 was out of stock) and then I ended up getting a brand new replacement system with 580m. Thus, I have had both cards on identical spec machines and have tested them both.

    If allowed to run stock, with the 63C power throttle intact, the 580m will average 15% slower than the 6990m in hardcore gaming sessions. The 6990m and 580m are very close, but when the 580m cuts it to P1 and takes a 20%+ hit it will always be slower than a 6990m that is always running full speed.

    Again, going by the call it sounds like it doesn't matter, since you guys don't have any room to adjust, but you should be able to recreate this in your lab. A 6990m side by side with a 580m in any game that triggers P1, you will see that the average FPS is at least 15% lower on the 580m because of the time it spends in P1.

    This is almost certainly true on the M18x with no throttling, but on a stock M17x R3 that is actually designed to throttle by 20% a lot of the time it is not true. A 580m at stock is better than a 6990m. A 580m at a 20% underclock is not. This gets worse if you consider OCing, an OC'ed 6990m at full speed is absolutely gonna slaughter a 580m that is constantly going to P1.

    According to the engineer they test at 28C in the lab, so if you get a perfect cooling system you should be able to avoid 78C. Have you tried my HWINFO fan mod?
     
  10. F-117 Nighthawk

    F-117 Nighthawk Notebook Enthusiast

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    Thanks for your support Bill! But the most important thing for me now is to get an answer to the question which system is the most powerfull (or at least: equally powerfull) the R3 with 580M in its original state (so including throttles) or the R3 with 6990M?

    Hope you can help me out here because if the answer is 6990M I may have chosen the wrong config and have to place a new order (I'm in love with the R3 ;), so no R3 is not an option for me).
     
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