Clevo + Ryzen: possible?

Discussion in 'Sager and Clevo' started by thegh0sts, Feb 23, 2017.

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  1. MrClippy

    MrClippy Notebook Enthusiast

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    Definitely agree with you and @Support.3@XOTIC PC (especially on the think-with-wallet). I think there's definitely a large market potential for AMD option in Clevo. Just look at AMD's 1) better future potential of more cores and better upgrade path and their 2) potential price/performance.

    Ryzen 2 on 7nm is expected to have more cores so can expect to surpass 8 cores for the highest core count on a consumer CPU along with the possibility for higher clocks. So I can see there being a potential market in a Clevo with AMD set up for developers and content creators on the go; higher core count on current offerings and the potential for higher core count and clocks on future CPUs is very enticing for devs and content creators as it means better productivity and a potential increase in said productivity. Intel does have their Coffee Lake and it does beat or match current AMD offerings in terms of multicore work loads (if there's overclocking to >= 5.0ghz). In fact, overall (when overclocking >= 5.0ghz) it probably is the better choice for developers and content creators because it beats single core loads while mostly matching AMD's highest offerings' multicore workloads. But overclocking varies from chip to chip, so it's sort of a gamble on whether you'll beat Ryzen offerings (one could argue that there's a lot of 8700k that can reach 5.0 Ghz but it's still a gamble). And the future looks bleak on Intel's side what with a so far lack-luster Cannonlake development and at only 10nm to boot while AMD is moving on to 7nm.

    The potential price per performance just comes from comparing Intel's and AMD's desktop market strategies; AMD has always been priced more accessibly while Intel has been more expensive. If the same is true for laptop manufacturing i.e. they can have lower prices (compared to Intel equivalent) for their motherboards in Clevo, then a Clevo P870xm base with AMD might just be cheaper. I say 'potential' because Clevo could lower the price of Clevos with custom AMD motherboards because of AMD's lower licensing/royalty cost in making custom motherboards, or Clevo may just price the AMD version similar to the Clevo with Intel and make higher margins on Clevos with AMD. But, man .... if they can deliver the former and have like a B350 equivalent at like 200-400 dollars cheaper than the current Clevos with Z370 chipset, I'd get that AMD variant in a heartbeat.


    I've been watching the ASUS GL702ZC, and I think part of the lack of success of this model came from ASUS mistakenly advertising this as a gaming laptop instead of pushing as a business/developer/content creator system. There's a couple of reviews, but this one probably best sums it up for devs.
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2018
    Support.4@XOTIC PC and sicily428 like this.
  2. Meaker@Sager

    Meaker@Sager Company Representative

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    Read through the thread, AMD has a certain barrier to entry they need to cross, they have to beat intel across all parts, especially performance/watt and provide support in a higher end market along with throwing off the stigma of their previous behavior with partners. It's a fair bit to overcome.
     
  3. MrClippy

    MrClippy Notebook Enthusiast

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    I read somewhere in this thread that manufactures had a bad history with AMD quality and support - particularly with AMD MxM boards. Additionally, it seems that the overall sentiment of the forum is AMD = bad overclocking = no market potential, but I wanted to offer another perspective of their potential. I might be speaking from a budget-minded consumer perspective, but for me, the barrier of entry for AMD is lower: if they can give competitive performance and performance per watt at lower price than Intel, then I think there's a financial incentive for people to purchase them. As you said, they could completely beat Intel across all parts (performace, performance per watt, performance per dollar), and I think that would offer 100% incentive for all to switch to Intel.

    And we can see that they've already sort of started to address this stigma of being poor quality/poor performance per watt. Forgive me for looking at BGAs, but compare the latest notebook chips by both parties: AMD's 2500U has a 15-25 watt TDP and is only a little behind Intel and in some cases it is matching the performance of its Coffee Lake equivalent, the i5-8520U, which is roughly the same TDP. AMD still has a lot of work in terms of driver support, but it's priced lower than Intel equivalents and drivers will hopefully get better with time. It's too early to say if AMD will fully get over its stigma, but if it is moderately successful in BGA deals with Dell, Acer, and HP laptops, then maybe there's a possible future for AMD to work with Clevo on socketed laptops as well.

    I'll try to better read the thread before answering next time...
     
  4. Support.3@XOTIC PC

    Support.3@XOTIC PC Company Representative

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    This was a few years back, I recall there was a popular AMD option that was being sent back so much that they were just offering to change to the NVidia equivalent for every RMA. Can't remember the exact model though. I wonder how much that affected the current state of things.
     
  5. XMG

    XMG Company Representative

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    This was primarily with the 7970M, loads of driver problems and with Enduro etc. The issue with getting AMD into laptops more recently i related to AMD's expansion back into the "performance" sector with Ryzen. I explained one of the main issues in the post below from page 2 of this thread:

    http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/clevo-ryzen-possible.801836/page-2#post-10469075

    Since then, we saw one a-brand laptop manufacturer launch a Ryzen laptop as expected, then in early 2018 a handful more followed. This was in response to demand from the laptop manufacturers, but you can see that one laptop manufacturer had exclusive Ryzen for a period of time whilst many others wanted to offer Ryzen but weren't able to. Even now, there are companies which want to offer Ryzen but can not - you could say that this is beacuse some manufacturers are further down the packing order for AMD, but the initial issue was as I explained in the above linked post. Perhaps another argument that could be made is that AMD was sensible in limiting the number of partners that it worked with on Ryzen so that they could manage the quality and roll out. Wether that was the result or not is open to discussion!
     
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  6. sicily428

    sicily428 Donuts!! :)

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    is AMD CPU+AMD GPU a must at the moment for having Ryzen support?
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2018
  7. yrekabakery

    yrekabakery Notebook Virtuoso

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    Yup, I remember the 7970M cards after a couple years of ownership were dying left, right, and center.
     
  8. Support.3@XOTIC PC

    Support.3@XOTIC PC Company Representative

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    7970M, that's the one. Unfortunate, there was a lot of salt surrounding it.

    Makes sense that they'd have a gradual reintroduction to the market rather than jumping all the way in though.
     
  9. senso

    senso Notebook Deity

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    Is that a side-effect crappy SAC5 solder balls used between the die and the carrier?

    Tons of Nvidia GPU's died as well due to that, and it was not only limited on older models..

    I replaced a lot of dead 740m's..
     
  10. Meaker@Sager

    Meaker@Sager Company Representative

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    For the first wave where you are exclusive with AMD I would expect so.
     
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