Clevo 2019

Discussion in 'Sager and Clevo' started by steberg, Jan 6, 2019.

  1. bennyg

    bennyg Notebook Virtuoso

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    Hyperthreading on or off has no effect on the CTP metric only physical cores
    NB:
    9700K(F) 3.6ghz base 8 core 8 thread 705600, 9900K(F) 3.6ghz base 8 core 16 thread 705600
    9600K 3.7ghz 6 core 6 thread 550683, 8700K 3.7ghz base 6 core 12 thread 550683
     
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  2. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    Yeah, laptop CPU's, I meant the new 9980HK and 9880H laptop CPU's.

    The 9900k / 9700k desktop CPU's would now be "old" CPU's. :)

    And, we already know the sucky HT treatment for the "old" desktop CPU's, with only the 9900k having HT 8c/16t.
    It's a big drop in performance this time for the laptop CPU's, seems there is more to the story than 8c/16t vs 8c/8t, clock and power limits most likely.

    Maybe Intel is tired of laptop makers not providing enough cooling and are performance throttling the laptop versions this time, like Nvidia is gimping the laptop 20 series GPU's.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2019
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  3. Meaker@Sager

    Meaker@Sager Company Representative

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    There is only so far you can go within each power band, you can't cheat physics.
     
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  4. xklis

    xklis Notebook Guru

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    Indeed, Intel specifies TDP as follows:

    "Thermal Design Power (TDP) represents the average power, in watts, the processor dissipates when operating at Base Frequency with all cores active under an Intel-defined, high-complexity workload."

    Also according to Intel:

    i9-8950hk is 6c/12t cpu with base clock of 2.9 GHz and TDP of 45W
    i7-8750h is 6c/12t cpu with base clock of 2.2 GHz and TDP of 45W

    Sorry for the ignorance, but i just don't understand how both 6 cores all running @2.2ghz and 6 cores all running @2.9 ghz can dissipate the same amount of heat power if tdp info about both cpus provided by intel is correct.

    What am i missing ?
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2019
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  5. Meaker@Sager

    Meaker@Sager Company Representative

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    A bit of fudging of the numbers and binning.
     
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  6. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    Intel's "TDP" ratings are at base clocks only, nice, right? :D

    It's a mystery how Intel continue to pull this deception off and get away with it.
     
  7. xklis

    xklis Notebook Guru

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    Could you please be more precise about this ?
    In what i was wrong ?
    Did i reported wrong specs ?
    And what do you mean by "binning" ?

    Sorry if this is very simple to most of you but i'm just newbie on this stuff.
     
  8. bennyg

    bennyg Notebook Virtuoso

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    TDP is a recommendation of cooler and is equal to the CPU's power limit or PL1. It doesn't take into account the higher turbo boost PL2 power limit which is +25% (but configurable by motherboard or laptop maker) intended to be set for a limited time. That wasn't such an issue when turbo was like an extra 5% on single core like it usually was (e.g. 6700K, an extra 200mhz on 1 active core only), the CPU never used anywhere near its PL2. Then Intel changed it up with the 8th gen and got way more aggressive with turbo, and the all core turbo was now set to this higher PL2 power limit, and 8700Ks came along which used that extra power on desktop motherboards, some with removed limits and timers. So half the tech press were benching this "95W" CPU using 130W and the other half were stung by the MCE-on-by-default fiasco and benching them at 4.7ghz and ~160W under long term 100% load. So suddenly a lot of people woke up and said "umm Intel you call this a 95W CPU WTF?"

    So if you had chosen, according to the "95W TDP", a "95W cooler" specified and tested in a lab to dissipate 95W without hitting 100C, suddenly you have a "95W CPU" out of the box drawing way over 95W, and overheating like crazy.

    As to binning - not all of the billions of the transistors and traces in a CPU are fabbed perfectly. Some bits of it are broken and have to be completely disabled. Some bits will be "leaky", that is, still work, but need or leak more power than intended. It's this combination of defects, stability, leakiness, and required voltage that determines whether an individual die is sold as a i3 with some cores, cache and hyperthreading disabled, or all the way up to a top end i7 or i9 with overclocking headroom to spare, since making different dies is expensive it's cheaper overall to rely on dodgy parts filling out the lower tier options rather than fab different dies for each CPU designation. So for example, when an individual six core Coffee Lake-H die is tested, assuming all its cores work, if it uses 45W at between 2.2 and 2.6ghz it's a i7-8750h, if it uses 45W between 2.6 and 2.9 it's a 8850h, if 2.9 or greater its an i9-8950HK. Within each SKU, there is a spread of "good" and "bad" chips - whether an individual laptop's 8750H uses its 45W at only 2.2ghz, or can actually do it at 2.59ghz, is the "silicon lottery"
     
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  9. Dakka3

    Dakka3 Notebook Enthusiast

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    Internals of Hasee's PB70ED
    4c6b58ee3d6d55fb18c5501963224f4a21a4dd8e.jpg

    All PB models have under-keyboard screws holding the bottom cover.
     
  10. cj_miranda23

    cj_miranda23 Notebook Evangelist

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    What is this?
     

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