BGA Venting Thread ;)

Discussion in 'Sager and Clevo' started by FredSRichardson, Nov 29, 2016.

  1. darkarn

    darkarn Notebook Evangelist

    Reputations:
    47
    Messages:
    655
    Likes Received:
    226
    Trophy Points:
    56
    Hmm, not sure if my sensing is right, I think BGA is fine if implemented right rather than being shoved down on everyone's throats just like that

    In other words, BGA is merely a scapegoat; the main issue we have here is how companies are using it in an user-unfriendly way
     
    TomJGX, Mr. Fox and FredSRichardson like this.
  2. Papusan

    Papusan JOKEBOOKs Sucks! Dont waste your $$$ on FILTHY

    Reputations:
    30,313
    Messages:
    26,098
    Likes Received:
    47,756
    Trophy Points:
    931
    There we go... My post below cover every post from you in my reply http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...-uneven-heatsink.797477/page-58#post-10401188

    http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...-uneven-heatsink.797477/page-58#post-10401198
     
    Stress Tech and FredSRichardson like this.
  3. FredSRichardson

    FredSRichardson Notebook Groundsloth

    Reputations:
    181
    Messages:
    967
    Likes Received:
    419
    Trophy Points:
    76
    Unfortunately I have already made my choice. However I believe I could have done much worse.

    If I had to do it again, given two systems with similar size, weight, battery life, thermals, build quality and cost, I would probably take the socketed laptop over the surface mount one. Maybe next time around Clevo will offer a nice 15" option.

    Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
     
  4. Mr. Fox

    Mr. Fox BGA Filth-Hating Elitist

    Reputations:
    33,216
    Messages:
    36,524
    Likes Received:
    60,206
    Trophy Points:
    931
    Agreed, but the BGA model is precisely that, and the lack of acceptable LGA options screams one size fits all. The very concept is flawed and makes freedom of choice effectively impossible. The freedom to select something superior is not even an option with BGA. Good luck getting an RMA if you draw a shorter than average straw in the silicon lottery. You're screwed before you even open the box.
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2016
  5. FredSRichardson

    FredSRichardson Notebook Groundsloth

    Reputations:
    181
    Messages:
    967
    Likes Received:
    419
    Trophy Points:
    76
    Yes, I can definitely see that. I don't think there are too many valid arguments for why a system with expensive surface mount components is better than a system with the same cost socketed components that are as good or better, but I guess there are a few including the need for mobility.

    The insane thing is when you reach a certain price point. From typical cellphone to tablet to ultrabook your are probably talking something like $600 to $800 to $1200 or so and the monolothic system model may hold up to there. At $2400 and more I think I agree with you guys that it is really questionable (unless you really need thin and don't mind buying new boards...).
     
    Mr. Fox likes this.
  6. FredSRichardson

    FredSRichardson Notebook Groundsloth

    Reputations:
    181
    Messages:
    967
    Likes Received:
    419
    Trophy Points:
    76
    Ah! So I have a similar peeve to vent: smartphone RAM.

    Every since buying my first smartphone I couldn't understand why the RAM was no upgradeable. I'm not sure there is any good technical reason why this should be, but of course I can think of many good marketing reasons: "If you buy the 8Gig version - you can't upgrade. Get the 64Gig version or you're hosed!"

    Or maybe it really costs more to add a socketed RAM chip? Maybe any change in phone width is a non-starter? But if that is the case why am I allowed to have an SD card slot on my Android?

    It is a bit easier to take with smartphones since the cost and life expectancy of the hardware is lower and the SD card (on some models...) does alleviate the problem a little bit. However, holding aside for a moment the people who are willing to pay a premium for higher performance ultraslim laptops while accepting the inevitable performance tradeoffs with open eyes, I don't see an excuse for manufacturers to propagate surface mount approaches to high end laptops other than through shear inertial or perhaps greed.

    EDIT: so yes, I join the BGA (or any kind of CPU/GPU surface mount approach) hatred group when it comes to high end laptops. I'm happy with my P650RS-G, but if I had to do it again I would try for socketed with all other things being equal.
     
    Blacky likes this.
  7. Blacky

    Blacky Notebook Prophet

    Reputations:
    1,974
    Messages:
    5,177
    Likes Received:
    925
    Trophy Points:
    281
    Welcome to the dark side!
     
    FredSRichardson likes this.
  8. FredSRichardson

    FredSRichardson Notebook Groundsloth

    Reputations:
    181
    Messages:
    967
    Likes Received:
    419
    Trophy Points:
    76
    Here's some cannon fodder - marketing material from a (let's not point fingers) vendor website:

    "The on-board, surface-mount design of the CPU and GPU keeps these laptops’ weight down, and allows us to pack more features into a slimmer form factor. The onboard components also minimize power consumption, which means less heat when you’re gaming on the go!"
     
  9. FredSRichardson

    FredSRichardson Notebook Groundsloth

    Reputations:
    181
    Messages:
    967
    Likes Received:
    419
    Trophy Points:
    76
    Does this mean only the rebels use BGA? I think Darth Vader could be socketed, but it's hard to tell:

    upload_2016-12-2_18-29-42.jpeg
     
    TomJGX likes this.
  10. Blacky

    Blacky Notebook Prophet

    Reputations:
    1,974
    Messages:
    5,177
    Likes Received:
    925
    Trophy Points:
    281
    Which is not entirely false:
    - does it keep the weight down: yes, by 50 grams probably
    - does it help pack more features: no, the size it occupies on the Mobo is very similar, indeed a bit of size is won, something like 1 sq cm, but it's not like mobo size is a limiting factor in laptops, most laptops have plenty of free space on their mobo
    - does it make the laptop slimmer: yes , by removing the height of the socket mounting which is roughly 5 mm at most
    - does it minimize power consumption: no, technically it might be possible, by removing the intermediary socket mechanism between the mobo and the CPU, the signal between the mobo and the CPU is stronger so in theory we could save an infinite small amount of power, something like 0.0000001% maybe ? I have no clue, but it's insignificant.
     
Loading...

Share This Page