Antenna Suggestions From Egghead Staff Needed!

Discussion in 'Panasonic' started by Toughbook, Oct 21, 2017.

  1. CWB32

    CWB32 Need parts for my flying saucer.

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    ehhh ...
    pay my way out and back ... i'll put it up in the tree .
    piece of cake .
    :p:D

    a problem with those wilson units is the lack of gain by the antenna itself .
    they use an omni directional antenna that might have 2 or 3 db gain (5/8 wave ?) .
    a modest yagi will have around 9-12 db gain , a high front to back ratio (rejection of unwanted signals/noise) and a tight lobe pattern (narrow look angle) .
    you might get away with this in a tree if you cut off most of the limbs and ran some guy wires .
    elsewise ... put up a freestanding rohn 45 (65 feet ?) or with guys to go higher .
    a description/pictures/gps coordinates would help figure out what is going on .
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2017
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  2. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    The old ARRL QST magazines and eventually the collected articles in the Antenna Books are gold, and lots of wire based antennas with clear instructions on order of build and materials + showing how to anchor them in tree's, not just a long-wire either, multiple guyed array's, amazing stuff.

    Yeah, I didn't want to go to a tower given he's got tree's, but again getting in touch with those local ham's / club and seeing whose got tower sections growing weeds and putting together a concrete footing and then the tower sections up over the tree line in the right direction could work too. Maybe run a long feed from outside the tree-line, unless it's a forest. :)

    Yup, giving exact location info might be outside the rules of the site... maybe via PM with someone close to his state or county - that's probably ok to talk about.
     
  3. CWB32

    CWB32 Need parts for my flying saucer.

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    yeah ... not a good idea to post location information in the clear .
    approaching the local hams , armed with some information is a good idea .
    with rohn 45 , it can go up free-standing to 50' with a 2 cubic yard concrete base (conservative numbers) .
    he won't have much wind loading on it .
    as a bonus , he might be able to receive a couple of the local digital tv stations .

    many moon ago i put up a quad 22 element yagi phased array on top of a 50' tower for a fellow ham .
    it was for working moon bounce and a repeater site that was just over the horizon ... knife edging the signal on top of a butte to access the repeater .
    it was used if the link repeater just outside of town went down .
    i did this four weeks after my first (!) hernia operation .

    we were real modern then ... i had a swan 500CX and the friend had an apple IIe .
    i remember the day that we received some slow scan pictures from the JPL , they were "drawn" by the IIe ... the first voyager pictures .
    i had a TRS M1/L1 POS-1 ... it would have been great to have one of the toughbooks i have now .

    i had three of the arrl antenna handbooks ...
    each was dedicated to a portion of the spectrum : LF/HF - VHF - UHF/uW .
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2017
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  4. Toughbook

    Toughbook Drop and Give Me 20!

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    Just to give you guys some idea of where I am and the layout of the land...

    [​IMG]

    I am on 12 acres situated on a bluff overlooking the Rappahannock River. I am completely surrounded by forest. That which is not owned by my neighbors down the road from me is owned by the City and is in a conservation so it can never be cut or built on. All trees are at least 60-70 years old with some even older. All hardwood... I think I have one lone pine on my property with about a dozen cedar trees scattered around. The bluff drops down in elevation by about 80 feet from the main lay of the land further up in the subdivision. So if I were to consider a tower to go above the trees... I'd have to not only go above my trees (which are monsters) but also the drop in elevation and the trees that are further up the road. We'd be talking about a 300 foot tower. I like my trees and don't want a huge tower as an eyesore around here.

    However... I DID email all the wireless providers saying they could put a tower on my property. I'd get free internet and cell service and also rent of about $1,000/mo if they chose my land. I could hide that tower on another part of the property and not see it. But it can take years to be selected and I need something in the next month or two.

    This is similar to the repeater that I have...
    [​IMG]
     

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  5. Shawn

    Shawn Crackpot Search Ninja and Options Whore

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    FYI: bucket trucks can be rented.
     
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  6. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    IDK if 300' bucket trucks exist, but here's a 100' :)

    112 meters... 367.454 feet... stunning...
    The new world record platform will extend the legendary Bronto Skylift HLA range (HLA stands for High Level Articulated) to new heights with the maximum working height of 112 meters.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2017
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  7. CWB32

    CWB32 Need parts for my flying saucer.

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    i can prove my memory aint so hot anymore .
    the *stratovision" project ... a retired (and now deceased) broadcast engineer friend of mine worked on that project .
    he was not super impressed with the results and politics ... but , he worked for the illinois education system , and the PBS of the day and they put him on it .
    there were a lot of problems ... including engineers that had flown in WWII and did not want anything to do with being up in the air .

    there is a possibility of using several relays , but this would only allow you to extend to the edge of your property .
    beyond that the issues of neighbors granting permission and all that crapola becomes a headache .
    supplying power to the repeaters is also a consideration .
    another issue is all of the hardwoods ... deciduous . without a clear line of sight , the signal will degrade in the spring and improve in the fall .

    without more exacting location information , it is hardly possible to explore options .

    stringing optical or coax from tree to tree could be done but , squirrels sure raise hell with the stuff .
    take a close look at them ... they wear little tool belts .
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2017
  8. kode-niner

    kode-niner Notebook Consultant

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    Anytime I get trees involved in my networking, either the wildlife or weather would destroy my work in short order, without fail.
     
  9. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    That's a given, all outdoor antenna's are vulnerable in some way to the weather, and I've had many sessions redressing damage from weather, especially for unsealed components - or those where the seal fails.

    Tree's move in the wind, and you need to design for movement of wires and guys with care.

    There are lots of good documentation references by Amateur Radio enthusiasts as they are the largest number of wire antenna users these days, but the historical information from the heyday of Radio still apply.

    Antenna management is a year round commitment, with seasonal maintenance, so be ready for it and plan ahead :)
     
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  10. CWB32

    CWB32 Need parts for my flying saucer.

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    mentioned was the fact of very few or just one conifer ... the rest being hardwoods .
    the conifers make the best substitute for a tower .
    i have put yagi and log periodic antennas in the top of 160-200 foot yellow/ponderosa/bull pines ...
    these were for the upper amateur bands (think 144/220/440 MHz) as well as the old uhf tv spectrum .
    the target sites were about 25-30 miles away and low power (erp = 10-100 watts) .
    when the wind blew above about 20 MPH the signal was all over the place ... but still usable in many cases .

    on-site and in-place repair of antenna systems requires the tinker toy approach or some different thinking .
    on mountain top sites things get expensive quickly .
    i once had an 11 bay broadcast FM antenna that had developed a small leak where the feed and antenna first element joined ...
    the materials are "hard line" constructed and a brazed joint had cracked due to some twit not providing proper mechanical support .
    i hauled a set of ox-acetylene tanks 230 feet up the tower in order to repair the damage .
    most of these types of antenna systems are pressurized with dry nitrogen in order to stop the ingress of moisture and raise the operational working voltage .
     
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