17" R5 Just How Bad?

Discussion in '2015+ Alienware 13 / 15 / 17' started by FrozenSolid, Sep 26, 2018.

  1. FrozenSolid

    FrozenSolid Notebook Evangelist

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    I've been reading threads posted by enthusiasts that have been really critical of the latest generation of Alienware computers specifically about their throttling under load and I am curious whether this is affecting all of the newer 17" Alienware computers and whether it is an issue for real world applications and gaming or whether it is restricted to bench marking and overclocking.

    I am in the market for a new computer and I want to know whether or not I am going to be having these problems myself. My current preferred build is the 17" with the i7-8750H, GTX 1060 GPU and a QHD display to be used for normal work and then at home an AGA with either a 2080 or 1080Ti for when I want to game.

    My thoughts were that having the smaller GPU in the laptop will keep it lighter to carry (even if only because of the smaller power brick) and the AGA will provide the graphics grunt and keep the heat out of the laptop (to a large extent) when I am gaming. So with that build will I have an issue with throttling and overheating?
     
  2. Falkentyne

    Falkentyne Notebook Prophet

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    Please read @Papusan 's posts in this thread as well as this:
    http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...rmance-explained-by-notebookcheck-net.808983/

    He explains everything, but you need to take the time to read.

    If you want a summary:
    1) it's BGA. BGA is garbage. Because BGA is a FAILED BIN of a LGA chip. failed bin means the chip didn't meet silicon purity quality standards to be used in a LGA processor. I believe the only LGA processor that is similar quality to the *UNLOCKED* "HK" BGA processors is the 8700 Non K (fully locked) vs i9 8950HK or 7700 non K vs 7820hk. That means these chips run hotter, and have less overclocking headroom. So that means they are DISCARDED parts of LGA that Intel still needs to sell to get money from. BGA has its place. But not in "high performance" desktop replacement laptops, which could easily accept a LGA Processor if the engineers weren't so lazy, stupid and incompetent.

    2) horrible quality on the cooling. Warped or woefully inadequate heatsinks, terrible thermal design, recycled platforms that were barely adequate for 4 core systems now being used with 6 core systems. News flash: a 6 core on the same heatsink will run HOTTER than a 4 core on the same heatsink if it's the same process and generation.

    3) cancer firmware. Locked down. Limited to what Dell wants you to do. False advertisements (5 ghz!!! LOOK 5 GIGAHURTZ !!!!). Misleading. Viral marketing based on their "legendary" name to mislead newbies into thinking they are buying quality. You are limited to whatever overclocking parameters Dell (or other ODM's like MSI, Asus, Acer or even Clevo (those without a Prema Bios) limited you by their own choices, to protect the end users from themselves. They think end users are incompetent and stupid. They don't want end users tuning their own systems, because they think they will catch fire.

    4) other stuff I'm not going to get into.


    @Papusan @Mr. Fox
     
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  3. FrozenSolid

    FrozenSolid Notebook Evangelist

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    Thanks for replying @Falkentyne but I have read Papusan's thread which is why my original post states I am not into overclocking or benchmarks and I do understand that a laptop CPU has always been inferior to a desktop CPU! I also don't care if it is locked down because I am not into overclocking and I am not reading Alienware's advertising.

    Correct me if I am wrong but isn't the processor in your laptop, in your sig, also a BGA? If so then you are using one already and I guess you don't like it but BGA, like it or not, is what is being offered by nearly all laptop makers. Please don't rant at me about it.

    My original question still stands with a small addition - 'So with that build will I have an issue with throttling and overheating' while using the AGA? My thoughts were that without the laptop GPU having to do any work the heat sink might be able to effectively keep the CPU cool while I am playing.
     
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2018
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  4. 0lok

    0lok Notebook Evangelist

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    If you want the current alienware laptops as of today then you need to spend time and money on it.. What I mean is that you need to fix the thermal issues by repasting a better thermal paste and repading putting new thermal pads to balance the heatsink.. My main issue with the current models is thermal problem and tripod heatsink.. If you can live with that i guess your good to go in buying one.. also plus what @Falkentyne said..
    http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...5r3-disassembly-repaste-guide-results.797373/

    http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...ven-core-temps-due-to-uneven-heatsink.797477/
     
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  5. FrozenSolid

    FrozenSolid Notebook Evangelist

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    That second link is gold. Thanks for that.
    You have to ask yourself why on earth did Alienware go for a tripod set up?
     
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  6. rinneh

    rinneh Notebook Prophet

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    My point of view is that you are kinda overreacting, the reason "LGA" based laptops run is that they are twice as thick and often by enthusiasts are tuned and adjusted to run well. Out of the box Clevo's also run hot which is shown multiple times in reviews and have their fair share of issues.

    The larger problem is just poor QC in most laptops these days and need to be adjusted, this goes for all laptops brands and types now.
     
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  7. 0lok

    0lok Notebook Evangelist

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    No prob.. It's nice to share info.. The forum here is really nice and. its. members.. They educate you.. hehe..
    No idea why they opt on that route.. If I'm going to guess it might be they are reducing the size of the laptop..
     
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  8. FrozenSolid

    FrozenSolid Notebook Evangelist

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    As you can see by my sig I am currently running a Clevo with a i7-6700K and a 1080 and I can vouch for the 'running hot out of the box' and needing a fair amount of tweaking to get it to run right.. The other downside to the Clevo is I use my computer at work and sometimes have HoI4 or another 4x game running in the background while I am in the office and because I don't have an integrated GPU the fans are running a bit and it is annoying. Don't get me wrong I like the Clevo but I am trying to come up with a better solution that suits me.
     
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  9. FrozenSolid

    FrozenSolid Notebook Evangelist

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    You are probably right but it was the wrong decision in my opinion. I've loved all my previous Alienwares and wouldn't have bought the Clevo's if I could have configured an Alienware to suit me when I was buying.
     
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  10. rinneh

    rinneh Notebook Prophet

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    A lot of people here commenting on it dont have actual experience with these laptops (some do ofcourse) but its not just the so called "tripod" it makes the margin of error larger yes. But the main culprit have been too thick thermal pads on the GPU side (and to some extent the CPU side).

    This is part of the QC story, if the correct thermal pads are used then the thermal are great. As I have posted multiple times the screenshots of while stress testing and a couple of other users as well. But most people have been focusing so much on just repasting and fairly poor results because of that.

    It is **** that users have to fix the QC themselves. But most advocates against "so called" BGA laptops all have been repasting their own machines with extreme pastes such as Liquid metal thermal paste. Thats why I say pretty much any game laptop now out of the box by any manufacturer isnt great when it comes to cooling. I have yet to see one current machine with zero issues out of the box. More important is can it be fixed or not these days.

    Yeah the tweaking is what I am talking about. For me gaming laptops always have compromises. So you kinda need to pick the compromises you can accept to live with. I just repasted and repadded my Alienware and it has been running great ever since. Especially when the ambient temps arent that high (25c and higher) I have yet to see my CPU go over 80c and the fans barely turn on.
     

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