Early Impressions of T500 from a Macbook Pro User

[hax0rJimDuggan]

I would like to preface this thread with the following:

-These impressions are from a couple of months with a 2009 base Macbook Pro Unibody and one weekend with a Lenovo ThinkPad T500.
-This write up will contain my observations only and will not have any numerical figures to back up any claims (others on this site are better suited for this).
-This review is not from a software standpoint. This is not Windows vs. OS X; simply hardware with minimal software.
-I was strictly a desktop guy until October of last year. Before joining this site I was unfamiliar with such issues as keyboard flex, dead pixels and viewing angles. I was pretty ignorant to all things laptops.
-My only other experience with a ThinkPad was over 10 years ago for just a couple of weeks. Therefore I have no history with ThinkPads and no particular level of expectation set prior to arrival.

This thread would be of most interest to:

1.) Users on the fence between the two machines.
2.) Potential purchasers of the T500 or similar model.
3.) ThinkPad nuts.

I'll get this question out of the way quickly before I move on to impressions: Why did you move from a Macbook Pro to a ThinkPad? My reasoning was simply from a business standpoint, i.e - the software I will be utilizing now and beyond. It had nothing to do with OS X or Macbook Pro hardware (outside of the 4 gig limitation on the Pro). Both software and hardware on the MBP are just lovely.

T500 Arrival:

The packaging was simple and sparse; definitely on the opposite side of the spectrum when walking out of the Apple store with a new MBP. I was pleasantly surprised by the look, feel and most importantly - weight of the T500. I knew it was going to be a pound or so more than the MBP but from the pictures online I expected it to feel much bulkier. THIS was not the case however. To me, the weight between the two was negligible.

First Boot:

I was greeted with some Lenovo video which I decided to watch. I was pretty impressed by the water resistant feature; I was not aware of that. After the video Windows took quite some time to load (I packed this with 4 gig, btw). The reason for the long load time was (in my opinion) the boatload of ThinkPad software that comes equipped, aka - ThinkVantage. To some or maybe even most ThinkPad users, this software might be very important. For me? Not so much. I'm the minimalist type and the only service of value to me right now is the battery manager. Once I weeded through the services and went though the initial Vista update pains, the boot time and overall snappiness of the machine increased. The MBP on the other hand had zero bloat and was snappy from the get-go.

Screen:

I would say this has been my biggest dissapointment with the machine thus far. It's kind of like a candle to the MBP's light bulb. The screen is dim and the colors do not pop at all. I've been through multiple wallpapers and can't seem to find something that I'm satisfied with on the T500. On the MBP I can put a plain black wallpaper on and it looks amazing. Now I still have some playing around to do with the calibration but even still, the MBP is on another level. However, with that said there are some very important options that I configured on the T500 that could not be done on the base MBP. For example - 1680x1050 resolution and matte.

Over the last few months I've come to realize that the matte vs. glossy is really a holy war amongst consumers. I would say before the weekend my preference was glossy but now that has changed. I now see how important matte displays are when you cannot control the light conditions. Currently I do have control of my lighting but in the future I plan to move around different environments and the matte display will definitely help. Also, the option for a higher resolution is something that cannot be overlooked. As a software developer, it's really nice to have multiple windows side by side. This is something I can do on the T500 but not the base MBP.

One other note - viewing angles on both machines are very good.

Keyboard:

I was aware of the great reputation of the ThinkPad keyboards. I was also aware of the flex issue with the current models (although heard it was resolved). I can say that there is definitely some flex on my keyboard - only the left side. However, it's very minimal and does not effect my use of the laptop one bit. I don't think I'll lose any sleep over it but I can see how it would drive the ultimate perfectionsit up a roof. Outside of that the keys feels pretty good, not much to complain about here. They're definitely not quiet though (and I'm a pretty soft, touch typer). The MBP in comparison is as close to silent as one can get with zero flex. The T500 keyboard is not back-lit but it comes equipped with the "ThinkLight", which seems to be a very good alternative. On the MBP there is the ambient light detector which will automatically adjust screen/keyboard lighting based on your environment. This is hit or miss with people but I found it to be an enjoyable feature and one that will be sadly missed.


TrackPoint/Touchpad:

I would venture to guess that the most well-known feature of the ThinkPads has been their TrackPoints. Honestly, I saw this as a legacy feature that was simply going to be turned off in favor of the touchpad and/or mouse. I have to say though that this has been my biggest surprise yet - I might actually use the TrackPoint as my primary means to navigate! Although clunky at first, it didn't take me long to realize the benefits of it. The ability to touch type & navigate seamlessly cannot be expressed in words - it must be experienced. But, if this doesn't suit you there's always the Trackpad or mouse. The MBP's alternative is the multi-touch touchpad which is the best touchpad I've used bar none. Both machines have great ways to navigate around but the TrackPoint is killer, IMO.

Gaming:

These days I only play Left 4 Dead. On the MBP I had pretty smooth framerates but the fans made it sound like the laptop was going to take off. Also, the wasd keys got pretty hot...it made playing for an extended period of time a bit uncomfortable. I wasn't really sure what to expect with the T500 but after a few hours with Left 4 Dead at native resolution/med settings, I was pleased with the performance. It seems to be on par with the MBP minus the fans and the stinging heat.


Hardware Options:

I won't go into much detail here. But I do want to touch on a couple of important things for me: the T500 has 3 usb to the MBP's 2. The base MBP maxes out at 4 gig of ram while the T500 goes up to 8. There's also the 3g mobile card built into the T500 which is a really nice option. Overall the MBP seems to skimp out a bit on these extras whereas the T500 does not. The T500 is a bit more future proof.

Overall Build:

Both are top notch quality. I would say all things considered - the MBP has it beat in overall build. I mean the thing is carved out of a single block of aluminum! With that said though, I feel the ThinkPad will prove to be more durable over the long run. It's more of a ThinkTank than a ThinkPad. It just has a look and feel about. I don't really worry when I close the lid and take it from one desk to another. I don't have the overwhelming fear that if I drop it, it's going to bend or break. On the other hand, the MBP is like a giant first gen iPhone. And if you have owned or held one you'll know what I mean -- it's darn slippery!

Conclusion:

You really can't go wrong with either. From a hardware perspective, they're both top of the class. The ThinkPad is going to give you more power and options at a lower price. The MBP is going to give you the sexiest machine on the planet. Oh, and it's pretty darn capable at handling most things you throw at it too! I'm very happy with my T500 purchase and I have no regrets.

Category Breakdown:

Initial Purchase/Arrival Experience: MBP
First Boot: MBP
Screen: Push
Keyboard: MBP
Trackpoint/Trackpad: T500
Gaming: T500
Hardware Options: T500
Overall Build: Push

T500 Specs:
--------------------------
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42V8173 VBB MS WIN VISTA BUSSINESS 64
44C1081 SBB G W VISTABSS64 US ENGLISH
44C1924 SBB 15.4 WSXGA+ TFT
44C1921 SBB ATIMOBRADEON3650WITH256MB
42X6309 VBB 4GBPC3-8500 1067MHZ2DIMM
42X6355 SBB KYB US ENGLISH
44C1926 SBBULTRA NAV(TR.POINT+TOUCHPAD
44C1917 VBB INTEGRATED CAMERA
44C6254 SBB 250GB H.DSKDR7200RPMDSKENC
44C1931 SBB DVD REC8XMAXDUL.ULT.S.SATA
42X6310 VBB EXPR.CARD SLOT/PCCARDSLOT
62P6054 VBB INTEGR.BLUETOOTH PAN
42X6325 SBB INT.WIFI LINK5300
42X6331 SBB ERICS.F3507GUSA-WIWANCARD
41W1508 SBB 6 CELL LI-ION BATTERY
39T6442 SBB COUNTRY PACK NORTH AMERICA
44C1941 SBB LANG.PACK US ENG.

[BinkNR]

Thanks for taking the time to put together a write-up—it’s nice to hear from someone who hasn’t adopted Apple as their religion.

Some quick thoughts:

• I too am a minimalist and this is why I always do a clean install. Yes, the default install from Lenovo is still too bloated—they should have button that says click here to fill your notebook with “great” Lenovo software. Also, Vista is still very much a pig—after running the RC of Windows 7 I can never touch Vista gain.
• I concur on the screen—Lenovo has kind of dropped the ball here. I’m happy to have the higher resolution, but everything else is par or below.
• On the keyboard, well, Lenovo has dropped the ball here too. They took perfection, tried to perfect it some more and are simply left with egg on their face.
• As for the gaming heat, well, let’s just say after many years and iterations, Apple continues to make face plants here—and Lenovo engineering, in this regard, continues to have great success.

[hax0rJimDuggan]

Thanks for taking the time to put together a write-up—it’s nice to hear from someone who hasn’t adopted Apple as their religion.

Some quick thoughts:

• I too am a minimalist and this is why I always do a clean install. Yes, the default install from Lenovo is still too bloated—they should have button that says click here to fill your notebook with “great” Lenovo software. Also, Vista is still very much a pig—after running the RC of Windows 7 I can never touch Vista gain.
• I concur on the screen—Lenovo has kind of dropped the ball here. I’m happy to have the higher resolution, but everything else is par or below.
• On the keyboard, well, Lenovo has dropped the ball here too. They took perfection, tried to perfect it some more and are simply left with egg on their face.
• As for the gaming heat, well, let’s just say after many years and iterations, Apple continues to make face plants here—and Lenovo engineering, in this regard, continues to have great success.

I'm glad you enjoyed the review. Thanks for the additional points you made.

[antskip]

surpised to hear of keyboard flex still. i too thought Lenovo had fixed that. flex has no place on a decent keyboard. i have a 4 yr old notebook with zero flex...interested also in screen lighting problems. sounds like less than 200 nits? at least the future is brighter (smile) with LED backlights much stronger...W700 is 400 nits but due to doubling the 200 nit CCFL lamps.

[hax0rJimDuggan]

surpised to hear of keyboard flex still. i too thought Lenovo had fixed that. flex has no place on a decent keyboard. i have a 4 yr old notebook with zero flex...interested also in screen lighting problems. sounds like less than 200 nits? at least the future is brighter (smile) with LED backlights much stronger...W700 is 400 nits but due to doubling the 200 nit CCFL lamps.

I was a little disappointed in the flex. But in the grand scheme of things - it's kind of nit picking (at least in my case). If I tried to explain the issue to a regular computer user they would think I'm nuts.

[MaX PL]

you chose the MPB keyboard?

ive used those new keyboards and god are they awful. i dont understand how people can use them; the keys are freakin spaced apart!?!?!? why?

[hax0rJimDuggan]

you chose the MPB keyboard?

ive used those new keyboards and god are they awful. i dont understand how people can use them; the keys are freakin spaced apart!?!?!? why?

As a touch typer it didn't affect me at all. My fingers couldn't tell any difference as far as space is concerned.

I think the keyboard goes to the MBP because: 1.) No flex and 2.) It's quieter.

[joey-t]

I also bought a T500 about 2 weeks ago. I have always owned Dell laptops, and once owned a Mac LC years ago. Macs are great machines.

It would be helpful if you listed your machine specs. I have the LED display which is a little washed out and skewed to blue. But I have adjusted the Blue/green/red brightness settings and the display is now perfect, except it is a little grainy compared the glossy displays I am used to.

Bloatware is a real problem on these machines. And there is no Vista only discs to accomplish a clean install. We are stuck reinstalling all the bloat unless we buy a new Vista license.

I have uninstalled all the Thinkvantage stuff except for the drive Active Protection System, Camera Center, and the Ultranav Utility which adds mouse controls.

I have also added a felt pad under the keyboard which has made the keyboard much better which I posted in this thread.
T500 keyboard flex fix mod

4G ram is great and is plenty of resources to handle all the Vista Services and additional programs like firewalls and antivirus programs.

The only thing I wish I had was an SSD drive. But the additional cost was not worth it. But this machine is snappy and very enjoyable.

Don't forget to make Recovery Disks, since Lenovo doesn't give you a set.

[hax0rJimDuggan]

@joey-t

I updated the original post with specs for the T500. Thanks for your comments.

[jaredy]

I too am surprised you picked the MPB keyboard. Being a touch typer doesn't make the tactile feel any less important. The quietness and back lighting are valid if that is of importance to you. But I am certainly never going to enjoy typing on a macbook keyboard. The old style MPB keyboard was fine though.