Chances of the next gen MBP lacking optical drive but with 2 HDDs

[HardBall]

Hello, I'm possibly thinking of switching to a mac laptop for my next purchase. Granted being a computer engineer, I will be running some version of linux on it a majority of the time, so I will be mostly buying it for the HW.

Ther is one requirement that I must have for any laptop that I use. It must have the place for 2 internal drives, one being an OS/swap/apps ssd, while the other being a larger capacity spindle HDD. It's not only helpful in achieving hig capacity and low storage latency/high throughput; but it is also helpful in storing certainimportant files redundantly, without the need to resort to an external usb drive.

The currently laptop that I have is one of the few relatively svelty and light that offered such option, an HP envy 15; which omits the optical but has two hdd mounts. The one I had before was a thinkpad t60, which had modularized bay that took either an optical drive or an hdd. I'm wondering how likely it will be for the next wave of MBP to offer such an option, I mean having two internal drives, while omitting the optical bay to keep the size and weight in check.

Any I sight into this would be helpful.

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[SemiExpert]

First off, don't expect Linux to work out of the box with a Macbook Pro, as Bootcamp is a Windows specific solution to dual booting. The Ubuntu wiki list hardware compatibility issues, which are numerous, especially for newer Macbook models:

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MacBookPro

There are boot managers that apparently work, but the safest suggestion is virtualization, either through Parallels, VMware or VirtualBox.

Various venders make 2nd HDD caddies that replace the optical drive in Macbook Pros with a 2.5" HDD or SDD. OWC is considered to be the most reliable but is also quite expensive. So, yes, plenty of MBP owners are doing a dual SSD/HDD setup.

The big question in my mind is whether there will be a big MBP redesign with Ivy Bridge. Nothing would surprise me with Apple. Maybe they'll just rehash the 2011 line with Ivy Bridge processors, or maybe they'll ditch internal optical drives and conventional HDDs. Sooner or later, there will be convergence between the MBP and MBA lines.

I'm hoping they keep the same case design and upgrade to USB 3.0.

[darkloki]

The Optical Bay will not run a SSD and I don't even think it's Sata 2.0 Fyi... So if you don't care about boot times or load times then it's not a big deal but it's not as fast.

[masterchef341]

i'd say almost 0%. Apple is probably moving towards built-in SSDs in all of their laptops (like the macbook air).

I can't imagine two hard drives being included in an Apple laptop. There's pretty much no way.

You can take the optical drive out of the current laptops and put a hard drive in instead (you should buy a 3rd party adapter to help you mount it). But I think you're asking specifically about Apple dropping the optical drive from a future version of their macbook pro and replacing it with another hard drive.

The odds are extremely remote. Apple would almost certainly do a complete redesign, and replace that space with some combination of:

- a larger battery
- a smaller/thinner overall chassis
- faster components with extra cooling

I'd also note that if you're going to be using linux and just buying this for the hardware, Apple is one of the worst possible choices for a laptop. Hardware compatibility issues in linux are particularly rough with these laptops.

[HardBall]

Originally Posted by SemiExpert

First off, don't expect Linux to work out of the box with a Macbook Pro, as Bootcamp is a Windows specific solution to dual booting. The Ubuntu wiki list hardware compatibility issues, which are numerous, especially for newer Macbook models:

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MacBookPro

There are boot managers that apparently work, but the safest suggestion is virtualization, either through Parallels, VMware or VirtualBox.

Various venders make 2nd HDD caddies that replace the optical drive in Macbook Pros with a 2.5" HDD or SDD. OWC is considered to be the most reliable but is also quite expensive. So, yes, plenty of MBP owners are doing a dual SSD/HDD setup.

The big question in my mind is whether there will be a big MBP redesign with Ivy Bridge. Nothing would surprise me with Apple. Maybe they'll just rehash the 2011 line with Ivy Bridge processors, or maybe they'll ditch internal optical drives and conventional HDDs. Sooner or later, there will be convergence between the MBP and MBA lines.

I'm hoping they keep the same case design and upgrade to USB 3.0.

From past experience, it seems that there should be 3rd party boot loaders that will work, like u said. In unlikely case that there isn't, I would probably have to modify and compile one myself, not a huge issue.

Virtualization is not really going to be an option, as I will need to optimize for performance and run multithreaded code that minimized process migration and have fine grained control over certain memory consistency models. And at times I will have to work directly with certain program kernels written in assembly that exploit specific microarchteture design elements from intel, so any form of virtualization is a no go.

I hope u are rigt about the new versions coming out. Whether they do a redesign or not, I hope that don't completely ditch internal spindle drives, and at least leave them as some kind of option.

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[HardBall]

Originally Posted by darkloki

The Optical Bay will not run a SSD and I don't even think it's Sata 2.0 Fyi... So if you don't care about boot times or load times then it's not a big deal but it's not as fast.

Ah, so u are saying that the sata controller for the optical is only a sata150?

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[HardBall]

Originally Posted by masterchef341

i'd say almost 0%. Apple is probably moving towards built-in SSDs in all of their laptops (like the macbook air).

I can't imagine two hard drives being included in an Apple laptop. There's pretty much no way.

You can take the optical drive out of the current laptops and put a hard drive in instead (you should buy a 3rd party adapter to help you mount it). But I think you're asking specifically about Apple dropping the optical drive from a future version of their macbook pro and replacing it with another hard drive.

The odds are extremely remote. Apple would almost certainly do a complete redesign, and replace that space with some combination of:

- a larger battery
- a smaller/thinner overall chassis
- faster components with extra cooling

I'd also note that if you're going to be using linux and just buying this for the hardware, Apple is one of the worst possible choices for a laptop. Hardware compatibility issues in linux are particularly rough with these laptops.

U make a lot of good points.

Although I think that there is a good chance that they may adopt the pcb SSD modules from the MBA, and retaining the one drive bay in the laptop so as to allow for dual drives. I mean that there would only be one bay for the spindle drive, but also a solid state module integrated somewhere else into the design. That along with losing the optical would allow them to shave the weight or put in a larger battery still.

Am I totally off base here?

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[darkloki]

Originally Posted by HardBall

Ah, so u are saying that the sata controller for the optical is only a sata150?

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Yea that is what I'm saying, if that doesn't bother you then it isn't a problem but for some reason it bothers me...

[masterchef341]

Originally Posted by HardBall

U make a lot of good points.

Although I think that there is a good chance that they may adopt the pcb SSD modules from the MBA, and retaining the one drive bay in the laptop so as to allow for dual drives. I mean that there would only be one bay for the spindle drive, but also a solid state module integrated somewhere else into the design. That along with losing the optical would allow them to shave the weight or put in a larger battery still.

Am I totally off base here?

Yes, you are totally off base. Apple uses a minimalist design philosophy. They aren't going to have soldered solid state chips and a hard drive bay. If you really want a macbook pro with 2 hard drives, you'll have to get one before they abandon the optical drive.

Again, it won't matter much. If linux is your goal, the macbook pro is a terrible choice.

[darkloki]

I'm just glad it isn't minimal to the point it's a ChromeBook and that iCloud isn't taking off as highly or hotly as anticipated... I am happy with just where it is right now in fact I often scratch my head at the actual though/idea of having a 15 inch macbook pro air that was once discussed